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Discussion Starter #1
Hey, I am looking into getting a new exhaust for my 04 brutale 750. There's lots of great exhaust info on here but nothing that answers my specific wants directly.

I will admit - Perhaps the primary reason for me getting aftermarket pipes is sound - but not for vanities sake. I live in San Francisco - busy city - lots of Traffic Congestion. I am a believer in "loud pipes save lives" I have an old M900 and custom Suzuki bandit 600. They are louder bikes in the lower revs and when your splitting lanes or just have tons of cagers around you on a 4 lane street there's security in people knowing you are there.

In terms of performance - I'd say the best mod I can make to get my bike out of a corner faster is to loose the 10 - 15 excess pounds my early thirties has grown on me. This bike performs so well, it's the handling in the twisties that excite me most. So I'm not equipping the exhaust to get 6 or so horsepower. It's nice but not my primary goal.

Is there any slip on solution that would work that doesn't require a new Eprom and midpipe or headers? I'm guessing even just the slip ons alone require an Eprom. I don't want to introduce flat spots or a poorer performance in any way so if I have to get the midpipes etc to do it right I will. But will the motor run smooth with Just slip ons? I'm looking for low maintenance solution. Maybe I shouldn't be so worried - I'm sure electronic ignition is easier to deal with than carb tuning. (this is my first bike with EI so new territory for me)

In terms of the sound. I love the unique note that comes with the stock pipes - I just wish they were louder at lower revs. Is there a solution that amplifies but preserves that unique MV sound better than others?

Finally - I guess my primary consideration at this time is the Arrow slip ons.

Thanks for reading.

Ro:D
 

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The best option and most expensive, is the Race slip ons for the Brutale. Expect to pay about $700. If you don't have a midpipe yet, get one.

If you like the look of the dual arrow slipons, fine. I don't know how they sound.

I have the arrow thunder on my 910R. I think it sounds great. It is pretty loud. With the baffle out, it is damn loud. That is the least expensive option. No eprom, no PC3, no special headers. Although I do have a set of race headers, the butt dyno can't measure the difference from stock.

You'll get lots of opinions on this so good luck choosing.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I must admit the Thunder is looking very appealing. I've watched (listened) to the various videos on youtube. The price difference and included midpipe is a nice bonus. It does look very neat and opens up under the tail nicely.

thanks!
 

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Just remember as you ride along...those cagers you want to alert only hear you after you go past...too late to save your life....Loud Pipes Cost Rights....they do NOT save lives.

That said..I like the sound of a good running engine and tuned exhaust, too. Straight pipes with no baffles of any sort on a Harley are just socially wrong.
 

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Just remember as you ride along...those cagers you want to alert only hear you after you go past....
I beg the difference, I had a Ducati S4Rs with Arrows full race exhaust and cagers heard me coming, not only after I was gone.
When I approached a red light, I could see their faces on the side view mirror, every time! Man I miss that bike!
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Your point is well taken but I disagree.

When cars are back to back on a freeway doing 5 mph they can easily hear a louder bike coming from behind and the biggest risk here are random lane changers. But a stock bike - you are absolutely right - you don't hear them till they are past you..

I'm not naive enough to think it's wrapping me in a shroud of pillows or gives any guarantees. I always depend more on a defensive riding ability to stay safe but it can never hurt to increase your visibility even if it's by a small percentage. Stock bikes are audibly invisible and there's little advantage to that when it comes to safety. I've been city riding for 15 years from 2 stroke 125's and 250's to my MV today and I'm fairly confident it increases peoples awareness of my presence in the city. I know the biking community is divided on this issue but it works for me.

Also it's not so much the volume that gets attention as the tone of the sound - a nicely tuned bike with aftermarket exhaust typically has a deeper drone than a stock bike without being obnoxious like a harley. It's this deeper sound that stands out amongst the ambient traffic sound.

As for "loud pipes cost rights". I agree too loud can be obnoxious. I'm not looking for something loud enough to make childrens ears bleed as I ride past.. I don't want to wake up every cop within 2 miles of me. My old ducati has a remus setup on it and it's too loud. I plan on leaving the DB killer installed as that seems loud enough.

The majority of stock bikes are way too quiet and come in way under the minimum legal DB levels. You can make your bike louder - making it sound nicer and increasing your acoustic presence and still be legal.

Besides all that - they do sound sexy as hell :D
 

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Just remember as you ride along...those cagers you want to alert only hear you after you go past...too late to save your life....Loud Pipes Cost Rights....they do NOT save lives.

That said..I like the sound of a good running engine and tuned exhaust, too. Straight pipes with no baffles of any sort on a Harley are just socially wrong.
Welcome to the forum LeBron.......:) I hope you enjoy membership on the forum, and btw..I agree with Squeezie.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Thanks Rand. I made a post about battery trouble and forum was a great help. I know many people will agree with squeezie - that's all good with me - forums are here to support different points of view. It's one of those arbitrary preferences some people have and no big deal..

I realize the chances are a bad driver who's not paying attention probably wouldn't notice a herd of Elephants so your probably not avoiding much. but I like hearing my motor:D Like I said - I'm gonna keep the DB killer on it so i'll try not hurt anyones rights.

I'm gonna write to mythbusters and see if they can get us some scientific evidence:D haha!
 

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Just remember as you ride along...those cagers you want to alert only hear you after you go past...too late to save your life....Loud Pipes Cost Rights....they do NOT save lives.

.

Oh YES they do


sorry could'nt resist:stickpoke


just a bit of a tease and stick poke for ol times sake :naughty:





.
 

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Debron,

I know naught about a 04 Brutale exhaust but have fooled around with the Termi mufflers on my Duc which are basically straight through glass packs ( a perfed tube wrapped with f glass. If you will tell me what your mufflers are like perhaps there's a way to get a little or alot more sound out of them without denigrating performance. Anyone describe their construction? A pic would help alot.
 

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The Thunder slipons from Arrow are really quite nice. We ran them on our 910 with the dbkiller in and they are loud enough that when someone gets in your way a good blip on the throttle is better than using the horn. :) The stockers are just way too quiet as you said.

We've found that you can get away with using the pipe with the dbkiller in without any eprom. It was a bit too loud for us without the dbkiller and you will need a eprom or PC3 if you run it without.

We have sound file comparisons on Youtube if you would like to check it out. They compare stock with Thunder with and without the dbkillers. They are also on our product page:

Brutale Arrow Thunder Exhaust

Let us know when you decide and we'll do what we can to help with the purchase formalities. :)
 

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I have used the Carbon Fiber Arrow dual can slip-ons (see my album for photos) and liked them. With the Cat in place they ran great with stock ECU and no dB killers. Nice sound but not too loud (See, I like a good sounding bike, too :stickpoke). With no Cat and dB killers installed they also ran and sounded OK (a bit lean and loud with the dB killers out).

Now I have the MV Corse pipes which are the optional "off-road only" pipes that came with the '06 and '07 910Rs and the race ECU (had to get that, as these pipes made the bike run poorly and no PC III available at the time). They have a great sound and are not excessively loud.

I like the looks of the stock system (dual side mount), although the Thunder Shorty is a clean looking installation, too.

Visibility from sound is often mis-understood. If you are stopped in traffic and a bike comes by you from behind with loud pipes you will not hear it until it is there. Riding down the freeway at speed, screaming stunters with open pipes on their gixxer-cbr-zxr-yzr-whatever blasting past me at speed are not heard until they are going by. At least this is my personal experience.
By the same token, a car stopped at an intersection with a loud bike approaching on a side street may hear it, but the sound may not be relative to the actual position of the bike. Ever notice when an airplane is flying by the sound follows the plane by some distance? Same thing.
 

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Just remember as you ride along...those cagers you want to alert only hear you after you go past...too late to save your life....Loud Pipes Cost Rights....they do NOT save lives.
If "loud pipes" save lives why aren't all the BMW riders dead?

The reason...

Sound goes out the back, the danger is from the front. At highway speeds where the fatalities occur, loud pipes are worthless since no amount of noise can provide early enough warning.

Loud pipes can only give ample warning to an approaching vehicle in low speed situations where there is little danger of a fatality. Rider awareness and skill can significantly reduce that danger or eliminate it completely without any need for "loud pipes".

Do the experiment yourself. Ride behind a bike with loud pipes and measure how far away you are when you first hear it. Pass and measure how close you have to be in order to hear it. Now factor in reaction times and feet/second of travel and bingo - if a driver approaching from a side road or approaching to make a left turn didn't SEE the bike in time, it's impossible for him to HEAR it in time to change his course of action.

Another thing to ponder: In all probability, loud pipes kill more riders than they "save". Noise causes rider fatigue, fatigue results in bad decisions and bad decisions result in crashes. Many of them fatal.

Meantime, ABATE has spread the lie and made plenty of money spreading doing it. Too bad about all those dead bikers.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
So what your all saying is Arrow needs to make a forward pointing exhaust... ok i'm kidding:D

Thanks for everyones Feedback. At this point I'll change the topic too. I want new pipes so my bikes sounds sexy:D I appreciate all the consideration and esq'z I do get what you are saying - It makes sense. At any kind of speed - distance etc etc the effectiveness is greatly diminished - likely non existent.

I have been in cars in traffic often - Stock bikes have literally surprised me when splitting lanes - Where did that guy come from.... But I can hear louder bikes and know they are coming up behind me before I look in my mirror. This is my experience in a car anyway. Granted these are low speed situations - mostly avoidable and unlikely fatal.

Is it ok with everyone if I have a personal comfort with a certain tone off my motor? I won't say it will save me - but I like it and it's not going to hurt me or anyone else? :D

Anyway, I ordered a Carbon thunder yesterday from motivation. Nice people and my order was processed the same day.
 

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I've encountered the same situation when I'm in traffic in a car, thinking

What the hell was that!?

On the flip side, splittting lanes and having a louder exhaust does make people
move out of the way as you are coming up to them, or at least they notice you and they don't try and merge in front of you as you're passing by. I think we all know it does nothing when your traveling at speed with the cars, and I don't think that's what you meant in your first post.

Next time we have a meet in the Bay Area you should try and join us. :moped:
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I've encountered the same situation when I'm in traffic in a car, thinking

What the hell was that!?

On the flip side, splittting lanes and having a louder exhaust does make people
move out of the way as you are coming up to them, or at least they notice you and they don't try and merge in front of you as you're passing by. I think we all know it does nothing when your traveling at speed with the cars, and I don't think that's what you meant in your first post.

Next time we have a meet in the Bay Area you should try and join us. :moped:
Thank you sir. This is exactly where I am coming from. Driving across any of the bay's bridges I think this is apparent. Lots of lane changers - slow moving traffic - and it's so true - some motorists do even edge away to give you more room.

I'll look out for your next Bay Area meet for sure.
 

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If "loud pipes" save lives why aren't all the BMW riders dead?

The reason...

Sound goes out the back, the danger is from the front. At highway speeds where the fatalities occur, loud pipes are worthless since no amount of noise can provide early enough warning.


Do the experiment yourself. Ride behind a bike with loud pipes and measure how far away you are when you first hear it.
Another thing to ponder: In all probability, loud pipes kill more riders than they "save". Noise causes rider fatigue, fatigue results in bad decisions and bad decisions result in crashes. Many of them fatal.

:naughty:
 
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