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Hello MV peeps:

I have a bike that I'm selling (not an MV) and there is someone in Australia who is very interested in purchasing it. I don't know him, but his membership, message history and PM's to me on another forum suggests he is legit. In other words, my "scam" radar is silent, and I'm comfortable with the idea.

I have never been part of any International vehicle exchange before and wanted to know if any one of you guys have any insight or suggestions on the due diligence towards completing a smooth transaction (particularly an import into Australia).

The bike I'm selling still has a little money owed to the Bank, and so therefore that has to be paid off before a Lien-free Title is issued.

We are thinking about using: http://www.geezers.com.au/import.php

Any help is most appreciate ... thanks!
 

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Well, If it's a bike that isn't special and isn't difficult to obtain in Australia..it kinda begs the question from the buyers perspective, why bother with all the hassle, the cost of importing, the red tape and expense of registering in Oz ? However not to pour cold water on the idea, if it is something rare /sought after it makes sense.

What would you do if he received it and then started giving you a hard time over something to do with the bike..Could be unpleasant and difficult to deal with. Can you not sell your bike to someone in Cal. ? Has he an agent over in Cal. who could inspect the bike prior to the deal being struck ?

I once sold a bike to a Belgian guy. He came over to UK..Inspected the bike and then gave me the money..I much prefer that way ...

Good luck

joe
 

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You can bring any bike into Aus for show or track, the million dollar question is can you register it here?

I've met the chaps from Geezers, nice guys. They are certainly a go for pre 1989 bikes.

Good luck with anything else. I tried to call a Senna a special bike...... apparently its not special enough :bawling: :banghead:
 

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I would suggest that the enquiry is genuine, as the strength of the Australia dollar makes everything very attractive to us. I know a few people who are importing boats, exotic car and everything in between. There is no risk from your end as if you do not first get paid you do not send the bike, the risk is with the buyer!
 

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I just imported a 1975 MV 125s from Germany to Australia. I used 'mainfrieght' they are brilliant & specialise in US to Aus imports.

What Rob said above is correct - pre-1989 easy enough - if it post 1989 he will run into major hurdles some of which may be insurmountable.

Anyhow, I made a trip out of mine took my son (16) & we 'road tripped' - I paid the guy cash on delivery that way we were both happy & no real trust was necessary. Took the bike to Italy & shipped it from there - I just got notice this morning that it will arrive in Australia Jan 1 - probably take a few weeks to get thru Customs in the holiday period. Can't wait to get my baby into my MV shrine (aka garage) and become part of the family - ah I digress---lol

If I can help with anything let me know.:)
 

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I've imported four bikes from The USA to New Zealand. I'll not be able to comment on the Aussie laws on registration but I you may find this helpful:
It's a trust based transaction and no two transactions will be the same.
1. Method of payment I prefer bank transfer. I use our workplace account as it's not unusual to save a few hundred dollars in transaction fees & locking in a much more favourable exchange rate than a bank will offer.
2. Bill of sale You'll need to draft a bill of sale, signed by both parties.

Here is the template I use:

BILL OF SALE

FOR VALUE RECEIVED, the undersigned, Name: XXXXX of Full Address & zip code: XXXXXX (Seller) hereby sells and transfers unto (my name & address & postal code) XXXXXXX (Buyer), and its successors and assigns forever, the following described Motorcycle for a total sum of $XX,XXX US Dollars as full and final payment.
(Motorcycle description / year of manufacture)One (1), XXXXXXXX
Motorcycle VIN# XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Seller warrants and represents that he holds the valid State (e.g.: California) Title and registration to said property. The seller has full authority to sell the said motorcycle and it is being sold free and clear of all, liabilities and adverse claims, of every nature and description.

It is provided, however, that the undersigned seller disclaims any implied warranty of condition, merchantability or fitness for a particular purpose. The remainder of the manufactures warranty will be transferred to the buyer.

Signed on this date: .

In the presence of: ____________________________ [Witness]

_________________________________________________
Seller
_________________________________________________
Buyer

3. Title validation. It is the responsibility of the buyer to pay for the title check to be completed. It's around $150 USD. Each time I have purchased a bike from the USA the title is sent to California to ensure that no lien is owing and the seller has the right to sell the bike (not stolen). There is no way that bike will legally leave the US border without that confirmation. Once cleared the title is sent to the transporter and held separate from the bike with all associated paperwork in the ships manifest.
It will arrive in Australia and I have no idea how the Aussie customs system works.
4. Bike preparation You'll save the buyer money & time by ensuring the bike is very clean and has an empty fuel tank. Fuel must be removed to avoid the bike being declared hazardous goods and incurring extra shipping costs. You're shipping a bike top a foreign country. In Australia’s case they have strict rules on protecting their environment. Any dirt / contamination / animal life will result in charges to clean the bike - probably with a hot water blaster. Don't give them an excuse to do that.

5. Independent bike inspection As the buyer I almost always insist on and pay for an independent appraisal of the bikes condition. I'd be surprised if the buyer didn't do that.

Dave.
 

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The most important thing re importing a bike is to get a Permit to Import. Information on importing requirements and restrictions, including vehicle registration and the procedures to get the permit, can be found at: www.infrastructure.gov.au/roads/vehicle_regulation/bulletin/importing_vehicles/index.aspx

If the vehicle arrives without the permit then it may be kept in storage (for an often hefty fee) or it may be returned to it's port of origin, both at the expense of the importer.

As has been stated, pre 1989 bikes are no probs. With post 1989 there can be problems getting the vehicle registered for road use. The Australian authorities are apparently getting quite strict on vehicles which appear as pre 1989 but are in fact brand new. This is predominantly related to hot rods/customs and vehicles with non standard modifications (engine, wheels, suspension etc) but can extend to bikes.

Once all is sorted re importing and registering the bike, then the bike preparation and packaging needs to be addressed. The bike should be fuel, battery and oil free - no fuel in tank or carbies, battery removed and preferably engine oil removed (tape on the tank indicating 'no fuel', 'no oil' wouldn't hurt). The bike should also be clean meaning no vegetation or dirt can be seen as Australia's quarantine laws are very strict and if the quarantine officials aren't satisfied then the bike will be required to go through a high pressure clean by an approved company which can result in damage to paint, bearings, water in carbies etc.

When crating the bike no timber products should be used as these will require the vehicle to go through treatment to prevent any insects, parasites, etc coming into the country. It is best to use a steel framed crate and perhaps wrap it in cardboard. (note: documentation that timber products have been suitably fumigated prior to departure from port of origin may result in the crateing not requiring fumigation in Australia but it's just easier to have no timber). Pictures attached for a little MV I imported about a year ago. Also a bit of irony in the final pic.

Having said all that there is still no guarantee that fumigation or cleaning won't be required just that it reduces the likelihood and thus the hassles and the costs.
 

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The most important thing re importing a bike is to get a Permit to Import. Information on importing requirements and restrictions, including vehicle registration and the procedures to get the permit, can be found at: www.infrastructure.gov.au/roads/vehicle_regulation/bulletin/importing_vehicles/index.aspx

If the vehicle arrives without the permit then it may be kept in storage (for an often hefty fee) or it may be returned to it's port of origin, both at the expense of the importer.

As has been stated, pre 1989 bikes are no probs. With post 1989 there can be problems getting the vehicle registered for road use. The Australian authorities are apparently getting quite strict on vehicles which appear as pre 1989 but are in fact brand new. This is predominantly related to hot rods/customs and vehicles with non standard modifications (engine, wheels, suspension etc) but can extend to bikes.

Once all is sorted re importing and registering the bike, then the bike preparation and packaging needs to be addressed. The bike should be fuel, battery and oil free - no fuel in tank or carbies, battery removed and preferably engine oil removed (tape on the tank indicating 'no fuel', 'no oil' wouldn't hurt). The bike should also be clean meaning no vegetation or dirt can be seen as Australia's quarantine laws are very strict and if the quarantine officials aren't satisfied then the bike will be required to go through a high pressure clean by an approved company which can result in damage to paint, bearings, water in carbies etc.

When crating the bike no timber products should be used as these will require the vehicle to go through treatment to prevent any insects, parasites, etc coming into the country. It is best to use a steel framed crate and perhaps wrap it in cardboard. (note: documentation that timber products have been suitably fumigated prior to departure from port of origin may result in the crateing not requiring fumigation in Australia but it's just easier to have no timber). Pictures attached for a little MV I imported about a year ago. Also a bit of irony in the final pic.

Having said all that there is still no guarantee that fumigation or cleaning won't be required just that it reduces the likelihood and thus the hassles and the costs.
+1 emmevi125s & Rob_b on the pre '89 bikes.

If the bike is post '89 you will need import approval as specified in the link above and current processing time for applications is +6 weeks (I have an import in progress). I sourced a used steel based and framed crate from a bike shop, had a plywood top fitted, then had it export wrapped. Even then, it may still be fumigated, because the steel crate I bought was kept outside and water had got in to it (advice from shipping co.) Treated wood crates are generally stamped on the outside to identify treatment, but a steel crate is the way to go, because there will be no flex in the base when it is loaded/unloaded, and will maintain its structural integrity after AQIS (Quarantine) open it for inspection. Check this AQIS link on import preparation:

http://www.daff.gov.au/aqis/import/vehicles-machinery/motor-vehicles

The only other thing I'd say is make sure you cover yourself in the contract of sale against all the hidden extras: import duty, AQIS inspection fees, dock unloading fees in Australia, valuation fees (if required), fumigation fees (yes they charge you for fumigation if required!), customs brokerage fees. Also make sure the onus is on the buyer to have the relevant permits and approvals in order, as if it is not then the authorities will either ship it back (at whose expense?), or scrap it. :jsm:

Good luck with the sale! :)
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Rob, Vincent, MVista, Castle. emmevi, carbonf4 --- These are extremely helpful responses... thank you so much. I shall keep up to date.
 

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Importing a bike into Australia

For the Seller, the info below does not apply. I don't want to jeopardize a SALE, BUT for the BUYER in Australia, he needs to consider:

Importing a Motor Vehicle (including a motorbike) into Australia.
The true cost to import a motorbike into Australia is:
(MSRP + Shipping/Insurance) + 10% GST = TOTAL PRICE TO CONSUMER
You do not pay any import duty on a motorbike, as there are no manufacturers of motorbikes in Australia and you are not affecting the local manufacturer market (you're only taking away a potential sale from a dealer).
Example:
2010 MV Augusta F4 1000 with a Manufacturer Suggested Retail Price (MSRP) of USD$18,500
(USD$18,500* + $1,750/$250) + $2,050 = USD$22,550.00
*The Distributor will be paying Wholesale Price, which is less than the MSRP, and will onsell the bike (adding a margin) to their Dealers (who will also add a margin).


Department of Transport and Infrastructure, Canberra
From July 2010, you MUST HAVE a Vehicle Import Approval from the Dept. of Infrastructure and Transport in Canberra. DO NOT SHIP THE BIKE WITHOUT THIS ! (Customs will not release the bike AND you will have to return the bike or destroy it at your own expense!!!)
Due to Australian Government Regulations, all bikers in Australia are unable to ship a motorbike into Australia UNLESS one of the following four criteria are met:
1. Vehicle was manufactured before 1 January 1989 OR
2. Personal Imports (for persons emigrating to Australia) OR
Applicants must satisfy each of the following ownership requirements.
You must:
*own the vehicle when submitting the application; and
*have acquired ownership of the vehicle from overseas; and
*have owned the vehicle while overseas; and
*have owned the vehicle for a continuous period of at least 12 months. This is the qualifying period. The qualifying period must have occurred immediately before you (permanently) arrived in Australia.
3. Importing, Modifying and having an Australian Identification Plate Fitted by a Registered Automotive Workshop (RAWS) OR
If you wish to import a vehicle that is an eligible Specialist and Enthusiast Vehicle (see list at http://rvcs.infrastructure.gov.au/) (NOT FOR ROAD USE, ONLY TRACK or OFF ROAD) you will need to contact a RAWS to arrange for the importing and plating of the vehicle (http://raws.infrastructure.gov.au/ , then search for a RAWS). RAWS can also import Road Bikes, but they will import for sale by themselves to make a profit and run their business. I do know of one guy who brought in an import through a friend of a friend who was RAWS certified. However, due to the limited number of bikes RAWS can import, RAWS are very reluctant and do not help individuals bring in their own selected bikes (after all, consumers want a good price when buying overseas and a RAWS wants to make good profits for his business !).
(RAWS are only allowed to import between 25-100 bikes per year, as dictated by the Aussie Govt, and it must be listed on the "Specialist Vehicle Govt Approved Bike Import List" - if it's not on the list, then you could spend tens of thousands of dollars to prove that the bike is Australian Design Rules (ADR) Standard Approved - emission, lights, tyres, etc.. must be Australian Compliance...)
4. Letter of Compliance
A Letter of Compliance states that a vehicle complies with the applicable ADRs at the time of the vehicle's original build date. Only the authorised Australian representative of the manufacturer, or the organisation holding the Australian Plate Approval for the particular vehicle model, can issue a Letter of Compliance for the vehicle you intend to import. It is therefore only in exceptional circumstances that a Letter of Compliance can be obtained. Very difficult to obtain as most manufacturers are going to protect their Dealership Network and hence, their sales market here in Australia !
(also, Australia/UK/Europe uses EURO 3 emission standards, whilst the USA uses US Federal Emission Standards, approx. EURO2, which is higher and dirtier than EURO 3, so make sure you can get it to EURO3 spec - catalytic converter, valves, lambda probes, baffles, etc...also light angles from left to right angle, orange indicators).

If you are eligible for one of the four criteria above, the Dept of Infrastructure and Transport will issue you with a Compliance Plate ($50 app. fee, about 14 days to approve). Then you fix plate (you will be advised by the Dept who can legally affix the Compliance Plate to your vehicle). Then take all papers to the RTA and get it registered (3% stamp duty based on total price).

I have spent approximately 300 hours disecting and looking for loopholes in the "Motor Vehicle Regulations Act 1989", "Motor Vehicle Standards Amendment Regulations 2009 (No. 1)1, "MotorVehiclesStandards1989, "Importing Vehicles to Australia Brochure VSB10 - Vehicle Safety Bulletins (VSB10)","Motor Vehicle Standards (Approval to Place Used Import Plates) Guidelines 2006 (No. 1)" and includes about 15 hours debating with the Department of Infrastructure and Transport in Canberra (who issues the Vehicle Import Approval), and numerous hours with Australian Customs (you only need to have a Vehicle Import Approval AND make sure that the bike is 'clean' - no bugs, empty all fluids before shipping, etc...!) If Customs require you to steam clean / fumigate - it will cost about AUD$200 (via a third party, which you will need to arrange).
RESOURCES:
http://www.comlaw.gov.au/ComLaw/Legi...3?OpenDocument
http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/roa...a_2.aspx#ninee
http://rvcs.infrastructure.gov.au/
http://www.dieselnet.com/standards/au/

For Further Information:
Department of Infrastructure, Transport, Regional Development and Local Government
If Calling Outside Australia
Tel 61 2 6274 7444
Fax 61 2 6274 6013
If Calling Within Australia
Tel 1800 815 272
Fax (02) 6274 6013
Email: [email protected]
Web: http://www.infrastructure.gov.au/roa...les/index.aspx
Postal Address
GPO Box 594
CANBERRA ACT 2601
Street Address
111 Alinga Street
CANBERRA ACT 2600
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Thank you getec. The overwhelming message I am learning today is that importing a bike manufactured after 1989 into Australia is not a good idea at all, and probably not worth all the hassle?

I didn't realize it is so complicated over there.
 

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Thank you getec. The overwhelming message I am learning today is that importing a bike manufactured after 1989 into Australia is not a good idea at all, and probably not worth all the hassle?

I didn't realize it is so complicated over there.
hit the nail on the head, been there tried that, can be done if they want to slip to the dark side, frame change not worth the risk.
 

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Hi getec, I started to switch off when the Gov told me I had to take the 07 SENNA to the Queensland University of Tech to get a science department to get quantifiable evidence that the lights meet the ADR's on luminosity. I told them that the bike came from the same production line, that the already complienced bikes here use.

No precedent aloud. A f_cking joke. Too many hoops, and on the other side of each hoop, a government cougher wanting more money, forget it.

Have a look at the price of the SENNA'a here. Oh well, I suppose these laws protect the investment of buyers here. Price can't come down with no competitive imports :wtf: If you owned one, you'd be jumping up and down to save your exclusivity.

http://www.bikesales.com.au/all-bikes/results.aspx?Ns=p_PriceSort_Decimal|1||p_Make_String|0||p_Model_String|0&N=1432%20604%201430%201429%201428%204294967237&TabID=1409178&keywords=&Nne=15
 

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It's not that it's not a good idea, just that it is heaps harder than a pre 1989 bike and raises the question as to whether it is more practical to source a bike locally as most bikes were imported by the dealer albeit some in very small numbers. These bikes are also the ones which seldom have a for sale sign on them.

There are quite a few dealers (Peter Stevens in Melbourne) which are regularly bringing in modern Itaian bikes from overseas known as grey imports (usually from Japan) and selling them in their showrooms. i've seen 916 white tail Ducatis, 999 Ducatis and 1098S Ducatis all ex Japan in PS.
 

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It's not that it's not a good idea, just that it is heaps harder than a pre 1989 bike and raises the question as to whether it is more practical to source a bike locally as most bikes were imported by the dealer albeit some in very small numbers. These bikes are also the ones which seldom have a for sale sign on them.

There are quite a few dealers (Peter Stevens in Melbourne) which are regularly bringing in modern Itaian bikes from overseas known as grey imports (usually from Japan) and selling them in their showrooms. i've seen 916 white tail Ducatis, 999 Ducatis and 1098S Ducatis all ex Japan in PS.
I approached some of these grey importers to see if they could help in any way but they are so pissed off with the government charges for licenses etc that they told me to fuck off nicely.
 

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Importing

It is literally impossible to import a post 1989 bike into Australia - what a :jerkoff:.
And importers (RAWS workshops) will only want to import bikes they can put a high margin on (after all, they need to earn money too !)
RAWS are limited by the Australian Governement as to how many bikes they can import per year (25-100), so if they do a private import, then that's one less bike they can sell themselves!
You're absolutely correct about Australian Design Rules Compliance - if you import a bike and there is NO listed compliance for that bike (even if there is already a certificate of compliance for the bike registered with the Aussie Govt from the Manufacturer), you can spend $$$$$$ in getting the compliance. I was told by the Dept of Infrastructure & Transport that to have your lights tested and complied, it COULD cost up to AUD $10,000-15,000 !!!! :shitfan:
EG. Bikes that ship from Italy to USA are almost the same as bikes that ship from Italy to Australia (the ONLY difference is light angle, emission standard - EURO2 in USA versus EURO3 in Australia, instrumentation from mph to kmh, noise level and sometimes tyre patterns - THAT's all !!!) You will also note that the VIN / ENG number is slightly different with a Aussie model and the USA model.
Make : Australian imported DUCATI
Model : H7 Category : LC Manufactured by : Ducati Motor Holdings S.p.A. Typical VIN : ZDMH700AA6B000001
Seating Capacity : 2
USA Ducati VIN: ZDM1XBEW98B007316
The "H7" is the Aussie Classification Certification and "1X" is the USA certification, as directed/accepted by the individual governments.
(Sorry to use a "Ducati" as an example....I must admit I tried to arrange importation of a Ducati 1198SP into Australia - FAT CHANCE! Would have saved $15,000 IF I was allowed to bring it in...)
BEST way to import an overseas bike - get a transfer overseas for 2 years, buy a bike and import it using one of the four requirements in my previous post !)
The other issue is that "grey imports" (there's another thread about this somewhere) are not 'happily' welcome by service departments (like one Ducati dealer in Sydney) who only wants to service and support Ducatis they have imported themselves. Think about it....if they started providing service to private grey imports, it basically supports the 'private' import market, which takes away sales from the local dealers.
I remember many years ago when you could import a bike without all the fuss !:bawling:
Yet another example of living in a WORLDWIDE economy BUT restricted to buying at the LOCAL shop !!:stickpoke
Whatever happened to Free Trade !?
I had a wild idea - admittedly AFTER i had a few drinks - to put myself up for election in the Federal Government. My slogan would be "allow bikers to import bikes from overseas without any obstacles"!!!
How many people would vote to have me placed in Federal Government to push for changes in the archaic bike import laws? "Aussie Bikers Party United" :yo:
 
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