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Just saw this. Not sure what to think. First impression is that I am fearful of the future and prestige of the MV brand.

You might look at changing your title some. I passed it up the first time, then when I saw the article I came here to post it. That is when I saw your post.
 

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WOW....I would like a run around MV. Brute and F4 are used for my special days.
I hope the quality will be there.....and its badged an MV. Will still need to be beautiful to look at too.

Very interesting.
 

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Yep, on the one hand it raises some concerns, perhaps unwarrented, about quality and what that can do to the MV name. On the other hand it introduces the MV brand to a new market which might be good business wise in the long run. Either way only time will tell.
 

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Back to the future .... MV was a manufacturer of small displacement vehicles first, with larger bikes coming as part of Count Agusta's love for racing..... I think this could be a good thing !!
 

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Wise choice IMO.

Introducing 350cc up to 500cc are A1 and A2 license kind of bikes. (European rules)
Which attracts customers that are on the look out for bikes like Kawasaki ninja 300, Honda cbr500, KTM 390.

And Asia side of world uses alot of these low CC bikes, so it might boost sales and increase profits to stabilize and expand the brand.
 

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So that's why Timur was posting pictures of China @ sunrise !!
 

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A new chapter in the history of MV Agusta...but totally in line with the only thing that all strategic MV Agusta decisions have in common. It is not following a clear path. When G. Castiglioni and T. Sardarov presented their strategy after the capitial injection, they told the press that the "high" volume strategy did not work out, and now they would be focussing on the super premium segment. Mono Stores would be created and the whole customer experience shall be revolutionized. It would actually be soooo super premium that the almost ready F4 will not be released, but worked over to make it even crazier, equipped with technology no other manufacturer is applying (maybe for a good reason).

Well, the first outcomes from that strategy look promising, new B4 and Superveloce are not yet there, but at least look fantastic and serve market demand for naked and retro bikes. So far, so good. But just when you think, this all makes sense, the brand is to be thrown into a segment that only works with low spec components. MV Agusta's take on this:

"Like all MV Agusta products, this new 4-model family will embody the unique MV Agusta DNA, its unique sound and vehicle dynamics will spark a strong connection with all the new riders."

I am wondering how the unique sound and vehicle dynamics of the current MV's will be embodied when they create a 350cc one-cylinder engine bike with a single disc brake and discount suspension. The super exclusive mono stores will have a really exquisite touch when you have to flood them with entry level budget bikes. This makes no sense at all, but for one party: Loncin can continue to produce ist stuff, but from now on with a MV Agusta badge on it. Luckily it is just an alliance. If it was a an investmentby Loncin, one would only need to take a look at the recent Benelli history. From Tornado and TnT to the Leoncino.

I have nothing against budget bikes, but taking one of the most prestigious names of the industry and building beginner bikes under that label is just bitter. An B3/F3 675 is a proper premium segment motorcycle. It comes out of the hangars of Varese. And now we get Chinese mass production sailing under the flag of MV Agusta. I really love the bikes, triples and fours both, but the company behind these great products sometimes can hardly be taken serious. The engineers and more so the design team create one masterpiece after the other. And after another great vision, they again have to fear for their jobs.

Instead of selling out the brand Name they should focus on revamping the (still fully competitive) B3/F3 for bringing them up to today's Standard: LED lighting, cornering ABS and nicer dashs. Investment would be close to Nil, but the market would appreciate...
 

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disagree, they have identified pretty much the only growing market segment in motorcycling. Not having a presence in the small bikes market is leaving money on the table. I'm not in marketing so I don't really know if there is a market for ultra premium small bikes, but it is entirely possible. Selling volume will allow them to invest more in racing and the big bikes that we all have now and would appreciate continuing to purchase.
 

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There are two prongs. New MVAgusta small bikes with Loncin powerplants, with design totally by MV and new Loncin bikes are being marketed under the Voge brand, not MV Agusta. Didn't you guys read the actual announcement? ?

I'm interested to see what comes of this in the near future for MV. I hope the small MV line uses more upscale suspension and brakes, but we will see. Voge seems to be the Chinese market version only.

"The vehicles, completely designed by MV Agusta to occupy the premium segment of this high growth market, will be industrialized together with Loncin, whom are the market leader in the production of motorcycles in Asia.

Like all MV Agusta products, this new 4-model family will embody the unique MV Agusta DNA, its unique sound and vehicle dynamics will spark a strong connection with all the new riders."

"MV Agusta and Loncin announce that their partnership will not be limited to the development of the new family of products in the 350-500cc range. It also includes MV Agusta assisting Loncin into entering the premium segment market with their premium range of 800cc. Through CRC, its state of the art design and engineering center, MV Agusta will develop an entirely new family of products for VOGE, Loncin’s premium high-end brand. The family of VOGE products will target the mid and large size capacity market through sharing technology and engineering with MV Agusta."
 

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What Indian company makes as many engines as Loncin? I don't know Indian companies. I'd

I'd guess due to engineering of the engines plus market and cost.
 

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There are two prongs. New MVAgusta small bikes with Longcin powerplants, with design totally by MV and new Longcin bikes are being marketed under the Voge brand, not MV Agusta. Didn't you guys read the actual announcement?
What I read says: CRC (MV Agusta) will do "development of an all new family of MV Agusta products in the 350-500cc displacement. The vehicles, completely designed by MV Agusta to occupy the premium segment of this high growth market, will be industrialized together with Loncin, whom are the market leader in the production of motorcycles in Asia."

So for me, that means Loncin and MV Agusta have to align on COMPLETE bike design that will be used by Voge in China and MV Agusta whereever they think there is a market for it. The production will be majorly or entirely in China and development has to consider the needs of Voge primarily (btw: Loncin's current output volume is 2.5 million motorcylces). For me that does not read like just sharing a Loncin engine.

Don't get me wrong: There is nothing wrong with such a strategy if it is lived consistently. If they have commercial success with it, perfect. But it is again another twist in what they do. MV Agusta has a solid premium portfolio consisting of triples and fours priced quite exclusively (a couple of years these same products were priced differently, e.g. F3 675 in 2012 USP in Germany ~12.000€, USP today ~15.400, F4 2013 ~17.000, F4 2018 ~21.000). Taking into account all the RC editions, the OROs and One Offs, they have clearly chosen the path to go exclusive. And now they pair with a company that is servicing a completely different market and the outcome shall be low spec bikes. For Loncin that is perfect. Big name that they share components with. For MV Agusta it's more like: Yes. we want to be more exclusive than Ducati, but our entry level bikes are basically Voges with (maybe) some upspecced components. Not sure if all the guys/gals that have just spent ~43.000€ on a Brutale ORO like that direction...

Imagine, reading the following:

"China, 25-07-2019 - The iconic Italian manufacturer Ferrari SPA and the Chinese industrial giant Dongfeng Motor Co., have entered a long term strategic partnership agreement that has, as a base, the development of an all new family of Ferrari products in the 1.200 - 1.500cc displacement.

The vehicles, completely designed by Ferrari to occupy the premium segment of this high growth market, will be industrialized together with Dongfeng Motor Co., whom are the market leader in the production of automobiles in Asia.

Like all Ferrari products, this new 4-model family will embody the unique Ferrari DNA, its unique sound and vehicle dynamics will spark a strong connection with all the new drivers.

This strategic alliance will enable Ferrari to enlarge its current product portfolio with the objective of increasing our drivers globally, expanding access into Asia through a partnership with Dongfeng Motor Co.."
 

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What I read says: CRC (MV Agusta) will do "development of an all new family of MV Agusta products in the 350-500cc displacement. The vehicles, completely designed by MV Agusta to occupy the premium segment of this high growth market, will be industrialized together with Loncin, whom are the market leader in the production of motorcycles in Asia."
You missed the second part of the article I quoted that talks about the Voge line.

Two prong - MV Designed MV Badged small engine bikes in MV dealerships AND following this, Voge bikes designed with MV help (maybe the 800 MV triple) that the Chinese will sell. MV might be providing the 800 engine to them, or giving them the engine design to reverse engineer and produce. I hope they don't move all 800 engine production to China, and they keep the MV engine being made in Italy...time will tell.

"MV Agusta and Loncin announce that their partnership will not be limited to the development of the new family of products in the 350-500cc range. It also includes MV Agusta assisting Loncin into entering the premium segment market with their premium range of 800cc. Through CRC, its state of the art design and engineering center, MV Agusta will develop an entirely new family of products for VOGE, Loncin’s premium high-end brand. The family of VOGE products will target the mid and large size capacity market through sharing technology and engineering with MV Agusta."

Voge was announced in 2018 I believe as the high-end bike arm of Loncin.
Hard to find any press, but here is one article about the bikes they currently are putting out.
https://www.bennetts.co.uk/bikesocial/news-and-views/news/2019/may/voge-chinas-high-quality-bike-brand

They look to be using non-Chinese based components on the brakes and forks: "...using well-known suppliers for components including Nissin brakes, KYB forks and Bosch ABS systems to make them into more convincing alternatives to established Japanese or European brands."
 

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OK, thank you.
That is maybe the way to read it, but I wonder why they then don’t just say Loncin will provide the engine for the small displacement bikes whereas MV Agusta will be supplying its engine know how in the 800cc range to Loncin (which I personally consider a failure as well). On the fproduction line for the bike assembly they did not comment (or I overlooked that as well).
For me this means China as I cannot imagine that the capacities in Varese will be sufficient and labor cost likely too high for that segment.
I try to ignore my bad feelings and join those hoping that this exercise will result in revenue to be used for the real MV Agusta bikes...
 

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OK, thank you.
That is maybe the way to read it, but I wonder why they then don’t just say Loncin will provide the engine for the small displacement bikes whereas MV Agusta will be supplying its engine know how in the 800cc range to Loncin (which I personally consider a failure as well). On the fproduction line for the bike assembly they did not comment (or I overlooked that as well).
For me this means China as I cannot imagine that the capacities in Varese will be sufficient and labor cost likely too high for that segment.
I try to ignore my bad feelings and join those hoping that this exercise will result in revenue to be used for the real MV Agusta bikes...
It is my understanding as well (hope they clarify in some articles and interviews) that the new MV small displacement bikes though designed completely by MV Agusta, will be built in China.

I get that they want less expensive feeder bikes to sell to bring people in to the brand and hopefully upsell them in the future to the 800s. Heck if they are good quality I'd love a 550cc-650cc twin MV Agusta, I'd want it to have up-spec components for the suspension and brakes. I'd be fine with it costing a few thousand more than the Ninja/Z400, Ktm Duke/RC 390, Honda 500/650 CB and CBRS and CBX - IF they have the suspension and brakes. That's my number one complaint on the starter bikes out there, they don't have an option for top shelf stuff. There is a niche available there for MV, if they don't cheap out on the suspension and brakes.
 

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What Indian company makes as many engines as Loncin? I don't know Indian companies. I'd

I'd guess due to engineering of the engines plus market and cost.
Well quantity does not insure quality.
Hero is one of the larger independent companies in India. There are a couple more but I think they are already in bed with other companies, i.e KTM, HD.

I think brands like Honda, BMW, Suzuki, and Ducati have the best arrangement. That is they are part of a group that major players in the auto industry. Personally I would have liked FCA to buy into MV Agusta.
 

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Well quantity does not insure quality.
Hero is one of the larger independent companies in India. There are a couple more but I think they are already in bed with other companies, i.e KTM, HD.

I think brands like Honda, BMW, Suzuki, and Ducati have the best arrangement. That is they are part of a group that major players in the auto industry. Personally I would have liked FCA to buy into MV Agusta.

Completely agree, the sad thing is that they had exactly that chance with AMG. In my view for AMG that 25% minority shareholding was a kind of testing the waters before going all in. Commercially the MVA sales are irrelevant to AMG and they never needed MV Agusta for boosting their brand. So there had to be a bigger plan in the background. And even if AMG would have stayed a pure marketing and sales partner it could have paid off in terms of leveraging on marketing efforts and establishing proper sales and after sales processes.


But when the whole tax fraud issue came on top of the general financial difficulties, it was clear that they would not invest further or try to get rid of their Investment. So it seems like a smart move to "promote" G.Castiglioni to being president (hopefully) without being able to take any influence on how the company is run.
 

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I rarely come here nowadays but this aberration has smoked me out.

We can slice this a thousand ways but the bottom the line is that an equation that laways holds true is described as: " x + China = UNpremium Any/everything" ( Yes I've invented a word). X can be any brand in the world, the Ferrari example is right on the money.

MV brought in Russian money to stave off bankruptcy, the Russians want a return on investment and get into bed with the Chinese to achieve this. Show me the passion for two wheels that coursed thru the vein of either of those two. In fact, both are synonymous with exploitation for profit and always for producing utter garbage apart from for military applications.

MV Agusta is on a trajectory to mediocrity (albeit profitable mediocrity), that trajectory will accelerate faster than the new Brutale.

I almost laid out a bunch of cash for the Superveloce. Had I done that, I be feeling a slight tingle of vomit in the back of my throat right now.

Future conversation, "Oh you have an MV Agusta? I seem to know them, they are Chinese aren't they?"

Fark me!
 
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