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Discussion Starter #1
I guess this is where the £££ are but I'd of preferred a bigger triple :crying:


https://www.asphaltandrubber.com/news/mv-agusta-f4-superbike-end-racing-claudio/


While we are happy to report the rebirth of the Cagiva brand, and the pending launch of MV Agusta’s new Brutale 1000, we do have some bad news to report from Italy, as this will be the last year of the MV Agusta F4 superbike, for quite some time.
While the Italian brand plans to debut three new models from its four-cylinder platform over the next three years, the company’s superbike offering will be the last to be revitalized.
As such, the Brutale 1000 will debut this year as a 2019 machine, a “neo-classical” bike will debut next year as a 2020 machine, and a new “F4” will debut a year after that, as a 2021 model year bike.
This news is about to get worse, before it gets better,




:nerd2:
 

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The Brutale is the volume seller, so they sell a few thousand of those and the profits should pay for a new F4 .....

Makes sense from a business perspective...they can leverage the "old" F4 engine and 200 odd bhp will be "enough" for a naked bike :)
 

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They are not using the old engine, and is developing a new engine platform to comply with new emission regulations
 

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How do You care CharLy?
It seams like You don't ride a F4 as such.
I personally do not need a +200hp Brutale nor a Neo-Classic.
If I would be in the market I would certainly look at a F3 or B800.
The Stuff Giovanni talks about is of my League.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
How do You care CharLy?

It seams like You don't ride a F4 as such.

I personally do not need a +200hp Brutale nor a Neo-Classic.

If I would be in the market I would certainly look at a F3 or B800.

The Stuff Giovanni talks about is of my League.


I might try the new 4 cylinder Dragster for a giggle but i prefer the triple engine - just fancy a few more ponies and a touch more torque but don’t want 200hp plus !

I’m not into spotsbikes my bones are too old :)

I ride my partners Monster 1100 and his old 1098 and owned an 848 but I’m a MV convert now :).








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They are not using the old engine, and is developing a new engine platform to comply with new emission regulations

Ohhh....so dropping the capacity maybe to nearer 1000cc ?

Will be interesting for sure...I dont "need" 200bhp on a naked bike either, I just prefer the more roomy feel of the larger Brutale, the 800 didn't seem as comfortable when I test rode it.
 

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A 1200cc torqueir less peaky motor would have been better than a peaky 1000 IMHO. A large 3 cylinder even better. Hope it has some fancy big bang counter rotating crank to justify the price they plan to sell it at.
 

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A 1200cc torqueir less peaky motor would have been better than a peaky 1000 IMHO. A large 3 cylinder even better. Hope it has some fancy big bang counter rotating crank to justify the price they plan to sell it at.

My take is they are going for exclusive in both numbers and price. Produce less and charge more so the margins are maintained or increased for more R & D dollars. It doesn't necessarily mean super high tech as it looks like that will be reserved for the new F4. JMHO
 

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My take is they are going for exclusive in both numbers and price. Produce less and charge more so the margins are maintained or increased for more R & D dollars. It doesn't necessarily mean super high tech as it looks like that will be reserved for the new F4. JMHO
I believe their new strategy is going to fail. Besides publicly flip flopping on every decision the CEO has made (you can find every decision the CEO has made in media and later find an article where he contradicts himself), here is why:

Wasn't the sell low volume super expensive models their old strategy before the 3 cylinder bikes? Last I heard it failed. Does the CEO think we have goldfish memory or what? That Mega factories documentary on the F3 spent a lot of time explaining how the market for exclusive bikes is not sustainable.

Hence the last strategy to introduce the clients on to the 3-cylinder bikes that they can afford (sometimes barely) and then make them aspire to the more expensive exclusive bikes so when they upgrade they move up to to an F4 or a RC.

If an F3 800 RC costs the same as a Ducati Panaigale v4 S then you know they are smoking something (here in South Africa, an 800 RC is more expensive than a V4 S!!)

Part of the fun of riding something exclusive is knowing that others know that it is exclusive. At the moment people dont even know what an MV is.

Ferrari is exclusive, but people know what it is. They have more exclusive models that people aspire to, but Ferrari also have their middle of the range models for the average rich guy to dip his feet in with the brand and later aspire to the super premium models. I cant see how MV will survive with only super premium models. Nothing to try the brand out with. Never mind how the dealers will survive only selling and servicing 2 bikes a year.

Lets now talk about reliability. Just imagine MV trying to sort bugs out when they only have 2000 bikes out in the streets. With more bikes at least the pressure to fix the product is there. I would be surprised if they even bother to try fix issues when they only have 2000 bikes out in the market.

Lastly, something MV do horribly (at least in my country) is the MV club. It is non existent. Ducati have a big club and they organise socials at track days etc. MV - nothing.

While Im here, didnt GC fire Bordi and bring in that clown from the banking side and his entourage to get the company to publically list? Im sure that was a more expensive f'ck up than their R&D spend.
 

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I believe their new strategy is going to fail. Besides publicly flip flopping on every decision the CEO has made (you can find every decision the CEO has made in media and later find an article where he contradicts himself), here is why:

Wasn't the sell low volume super expensive models their old strategy before the 3 cylinder bikes? Last I heard it failed. Does the CEO think we have goldfish memory or what? That Mega factories documentary on the F3 spent a lot of time explaining how the market for exclusive bikes is not sustainable.

Hence the last strategy to introduce the clients on to the 3-cylinder bikes that they can afford (sometimes barely) and then make them aspire to the more expensive exclusive bikes so when they upgrade they move up to to an F4 or a RC.

If an F3 800 RC costs the same as a Ducati Panaigale v4 S then you know they are smoking something (here in South Africa, an 800 RC is more expensive than a V4 S!!)

Part of the fun of riding something exclusive is knowing that others know that it is exclusive. At the moment people dont even know what an MV is.

Ferrari is exclusive, but people know what it is. They have more exclusive models that people aspire to, but Ferrari also have their middle of the range models for the average rich guy to dip his feet in with the brand and later aspire to the super premium models. I cant see how MV will survive with only super premium models. Nothing to try the brand out with. Never mind how the dealers will survive only selling and servicing 2 bikes a year.

Lets now talk about reliability. Just imagine MV trying to sort bugs out when they only have 2000 bikes out in the streets. With more bikes at least the pressure to fix the product is there. I would be surprised if they even bother to try fix issues when they only have 2000 bikes out in the market.

Lastly, something MV do horribly (at least in my country) is the MV club. It is non existent. Ducati have a big club and they organise socials at track days etc. MV - nothing.

While Im here, didnt GC fire Bordi and bring in that clown from the banking side and his entourage to get the company to publically list? Im sure that was a more expensive f'ck up than their R&D spend.
I can't agree more. And I'd like to add here in the U.S. the dealer network is very few and far between. So when these new platforms start showing up imagine what an additional pain in the ass it will be when its time to sort the bugs out. I hope were both wrong
 

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I can't agree more. And I'd like to add here in the U.S. the dealer network is very few and far between. So when these new platforms start showing up imagine what an additional pain in the ass it will be when its time to sort the bugs out. I hope were both wrong
I believe their new strategy is going to fail. Besides publicly flip flopping on every decision the CEO has made (you can find every decision the CEO has made in media and later find an article where he contradicts himself), here is why:

Wasn't the sell low volume super expensive models their old strategy before the 3 cylinder bikes? Last I heard it failed. Does the CEO think we have goldfish memory or what? That Mega factories documentary on the F3 spent a lot of time explaining how the market for exclusive bikes is not sustainable.

Hence the last strategy to introduce the clients on to the 3-cylinder bikes that they can afford (sometimes barely) and then make them aspire to the more expensive exclusive bikes so when they upgrade they move up to to an F4 or a RC.

If an F3 800 RC costs the same as a Ducati Panaigale v4 S then you know they are smoking something (here in South Africa, an 800 RC is more expensive than a V4 S!!)

Part of the fun of riding something exclusive is knowing that others know that it is exclusive. At the moment people dont even know what an MV is.

Ferrari is exclusive, but people know what it is. They have more exclusive models that people aspire to, but Ferrari also have their middle of the range models for the average rich guy to dip his feet in with the brand and later aspire to the super premium models. I cant see how MV will survive with only super premium models. Nothing to try the brand out with. Never mind how the dealers will survive only selling and servicing 2 bikes a year.

Lets now talk about reliability. Just imagine MV trying to sort bugs out when they only have 2000 bikes out in the streets. With more bikes at least the pressure to fix the product is there. I would be surprised if they even bother to try fix issues when they only have 2000 bikes out in the market.

Lastly, something MV do horribly (at least in my country) is the MV club. It is non existent. Ducati have a big club and they organise socials at track days etc. MV - nothing.

While Im here, didnt GC fire Bordi and bring in that clown from the banking side and his entourage to get the company to publically list? Im sure that was a more expensive f'ck up than their R&D spend.

You could be right. I just gave my take on what they are trying to accomplish. Not that it will be successful.


I don't think there is any intention to bring the company public. That would be a nightmare for GC and he probably wouldn't survive at the helm. And likely the "banking clown" is needed and possibly a good thing. Wouldn't surprise me if it was a condition of the deal. GC has shown that his handling of the financing is sub par.
 

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You could be right. I just gave my take on what they are trying to accomplish. Not that it will be successful.


I don't think there is any intention to bring the company public. That would be a nightmare for GC and he probably wouldn't survive at the helm. And likely the "banking clown" is needed and possibly a good thing. Wouldn't surprise me if it was a condition of the deal. GC has shown that his handling of the financing is sub par.
GC employed Giovanni Girelli, the former CEO of Banca Generali along with all his cohorts back in 2014/2015. GC says in the link below from back in 2015 that 70% of MVs management was changed after he employed GG.

Interview: MV Agusta's Giovanni Castiglioni ? Family Capital

GC was planning to list the company not too long ago before the crisis. Im sure their overhead cost sky rocketed after employing the bankers. GC fired Girelli along with all his management after the crisis and he wasn't shy to put blame on him.

The real question we have to ask is why did GC fire Masimo Bordi in 2012/2013? Was it because of the whole drama regarding the poor fueling issues on the first F3s?
 

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GC employed Giovanni Girelli, the former CEO of Banca Generali along with all his cohorts back in 2014/2015. GC says in the link below from back in 2015 that 70% of MVs management was changed after he employed GG.

Interview: MV Agusta's Giovanni Castiglioni ? Family Capital

GC was planning to list the company not too long ago before the crisis. Im sure their overhead cost sky rocketed after employing the bankers. GC fired Girelli along with all his management after the crisis and he wasn't shy to put blame on him.

The real question we have to ask is why did GC fire Masimo Bordi in 2012/2013? Was it because of the whole drama regarding the poor fueling issues on the first F3s?

Sorry. Maybe we're talking about two different things here. I thought you were referring to Saradov. But you are correct that GC has been unable to stick to a decision.
 
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