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Discussion Starter #1
On a nother thread I said somethin about the 2010+ F4 being a new generation of F4, so I got to thinking about all the different Generations of F4.

Here it is:

1st Gen: 98-04 with the 750cc moto (there were the whole EVO II and EVO III, not sure if you would call it different generations)

2nd Gen: 05-08 new 998cc motors
05-06 "S" model
07 R model
08 312R

3rd Gen: 09 1078 with the 312RR

4th Gen: 2010+ back to 998cc motor although different from 3rd Gen and redesigned.

I am missing something? :drummer:
 

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There are also the TSS models, (Tamburini and Veltro) which are, I suppose, a slight variation on the 998cc motor. But as these are both limited edition models of what you have described as 2nd generation perhaps they could be referred to as 2a in your catalog.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
The Veltro and the Tamburini had the same motor? I thought that the Veltro had a similar motor to the Senna.

Generation 2Alpha I like that.
 

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The Veltro and the Tamburini had the same motor?
That isn't what I said. I believe the Veltro engines produced more HP than the Tamburini bikes, I was referring to the Torque Shift Sytem (TSS) that is unique to both of these models in the F4 range to date.
 

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Hi John, the F4CC also has the Torque Shift System.

Interestingly, I believe that the 1000R uses the Senna as it's base model as evidenced by the ECU they both share. This ECU is referred to here as the 5SM and the Senna predates the 1000R as it was the first MV Agusta to be sold with this new engine management system. The 5SM ECU superseded the 16M ECU found on the 1000S & Tamburini.
I think that one way of categorizing the MV F4 range would be based on the engine management system, buy it's not the only way of doing it I'm sure.
Hope that helps untangle things a little.
Dave.
 

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Hi John, the F4CC also has the Torque Shift System.

Interestingly, I believe that the 1000R uses the Senna as it's base model as evidenced by the ECU they both share. This ECU is referred to here as the 5SM and the Senna predates the 1000R as it was the first MV Agusta to be sold with this new engine management system. The 5SM ECU superseded the 16M ECU found on the 1000S & Tamburini.
I think that one way of categorizing the MV F4 range would be based on the engine management system, buy it's not the only way of doing it I'm sure.
Hope that helps untangle things a little.
Dave.[/QUOT

Haven't all y10 models have the torque shift system standard now also?
 

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Hi John, the F4CC also has the Torque Shift System.

Interestingly, I believe that the 1000R uses the Senna as it's base model as evidenced by the ECU they both share. This ECU is referred to here as the 5SM and the Senna predates the 1000R as it was the first MV Agusta to be sold with this new engine management system. The 5SM ECU superseded the 16M ECU found on the 1000S & Tamburini.
I think that one way of categorizing the MV F4 range would be based on the engine management system, buy it's not the only way of doing it I'm sure.
Hope that helps untangle things a little.
Dave.[/QUOT

Haven't all y10 models have the torque shift system standard now also?
Yes, but I hear that it gets stuck. :)
 

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On a nother thread I said somethin about the 2010+ F4 being a new generation of F4, so I got to thinking about all the different Generations of F4.
I consider them as follows (this is my personal categorisation)
Major Generations:
First generation - 750cc Bikes
Second Generation - 1000 and 1078cc (Bikes to 2009)
Third Generation - 2010 bikes and beyond.

Within each generation there are sub-categories
First Generation: 3 iterations up to Evo III
Second Generation: 4 iterations, 1000S, 1000R, 1000R312 1078RR
Third Generation: 2 iterations (so far)...

The specials such as the 750SPR, 1000 Ago, Taburini, CC, Veltro etc are often specials of the main models introducing a newer version or just plain a limited edition - this isn't to belittle these specials, but they are usually a means of trialling newer special parts that eventually filter into the regular models. For Example, the 750SPR became the Evo III, the 1000 Ago became the 1000S, the 1000 Senna was the basis of the 1000R, the CC was the trail of the 1087 motor which became the 312RR.

Andrew...
 

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I'd say 99-09 1st gen, 10+ 2nd gen.

Minor differences do not a generation make.
 

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I consider them as follows (this is my personal categorisation)
Major Generations:
First generation - 750cc Bikes
Second Generation - 1000 and 1078cc (Bikes to 2009)
Third Generation - 2010 bikes and beyond.

Within each generation there are sub-categories
First Generation: 3 iterations up to Evo III
Second Generation: 4 iterations, 1000S, 1000R, 1000R312 1078RR
Third Generation: 2 iterations (so far)...

The specials such as the 750SPR, 1000 Ago, Taburini, CC, Veltro etc are often specials of the main models introducing a newer version or just plain a limited edition - this isn't to belittle these specials, but they are usually a means of trialling newer special parts that eventually filter into the regular models. For Example, the 750SPR became the Evo III, the 1000 Ago became the 1000S, the 1000 Senna was the basis of the 1000R, the CC was the trail of the 1087 motor which became the 312RR.

Andrew...
There are quite few differences between the SPR engine and the rest of the 750s that came before it.
 

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I'd say 99-09 1st gen, 10+ 2nd gen.

Minor differences do not a generation make.

Correct. Displacement alone cannot count for new generation, since the frame was pretty much identical till 2010, wiring harness was very similar. Bodywork was identical all the time.

You could put 1000 S, R and others in subcategory, but not new generation. Like you cannot say the new Corsacorta is new generation - it isn't, just iteration of Gen II bike.
 

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On a nother thread I said somethin about the 2010+ F4 being a new generation of F4, so I got to thinking about all the different Generations of F4.

Here it is:

1st Gen: 98-04 with the 750cc moto (there were the whole EVO II and EVO III, not sure if you would call it different generations)

2nd Gen: 05-08 new 998cc motors
05-06 "S" model
07 R model
08 312R

3rd Gen: 09 1078 with the 312RR

4th Gen: 2010+ back to 998cc motor although different from 3rd Gen and redesigned.

I am missing something? :drummer:
How about the new F4RR as it has a new motor and suspension would that be a new generation?
 

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How about the new F4RR as it has a new motor and suspension would that be a new generation?
No.same frame,body work etc
Look at Ducati ,the original 916 and last 998.Different engine but frame body work the same.Still the same generation bike
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Many of you guys know A LOT more about MV Agustas and Motorcycles in general than I do, so this was more to see what people thought.

I have mentioned before, I am a HUGE fan of the Dodge Viper and the 94-02 althought they have the same body style (at least to the untrained eye) it has two generations and the generation change is based on the motor. The 03-10 same thing there are two generations same thing.

I am currious.
As some said the limited edition bikes brought new parts or tech that came stock on follow on years, like the Senna for instance.
 

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Dan I think your on spot with this and your generation categories.

I think the limited models in the 750 world and the 1000cc to include the TSS, 312R version would be considered Variations of that Generation model and the 312RR would be its own generation due to the motor change and that alone makes have nothing in common with the 312R or other 1000cc's
 

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I don't see how you can make the argument that displacement makes a generation :wtf:

Is the '05 Brutale 750 a different generation from the '06 910? i don't think anyone would argue that, not successfully anyway.
How about this new 1090R, that is identical to the 920R, except for displacement? That make them 2 different generation of Brutale? No.
 

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The thread is F4 :f4:generations John, not Brutales:brutale:. I do see your point however, although isn't this getting just a bit serious now, I believe Spartakus was only having a bit of fun starting the thread off. At the end of the day everyone will probably have a different view anyway.
 

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Gentlemen just to add to the subcategories lets not forget about the F4-750 SR, and the F4-Nero(i believe Alex from Gutsy is selling one) and a few others(like the ones given to pilots). but IMO i would categorize by frame and body, so yes only 2 GEN. just my 2 cents.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I believe Spartakus was only having a bit of fun starting the thread
That is correct

Gentlemen IMO i would categorize by frame and body, so yes only 2 GEN. just my 2 cents.
That is a very good way to look at it as well, Frame and Body since there are a number of varients
 
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