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EVERY MV OWNER PLEASE READ YOUR HELP IS NEEDED AND I NEED YOUR INPUT

13K views 192 replies 54 participants last post by  MacStrine 
#1 ·
Many of you guys may have watched a recent live interview with the ceo of mv and the mvagusta motor instagram page. They were answering questions from the public for timur to answer and one question was when will we see the new f4 and what will it be

The new f4 is not coming out for another 5 years and will either be a fully electric bike or a hybrid! Yes you heard me.

So i would like to ask the whole mvagusta.net community what do you think of the most iconic bike in the world being hybrid or electric ? What do you think will happen to MVs image? Do you think they should leave f4 as a normal combustibale engine and make a seperate electric bike?

Everyone on the forum i ask you to all read this and give me your honest opinions because i dont know what would make them kill the f4

I will start off by saying that the F4 is the la ferrari of mv its the superbike the bike that we all can say is a mv its iconic and has been an icon for so many of us. I am actually devestated that it will be another 5 years before we see a F4. I actually cringe at the idea it maybe be electric i think they should have a separate electric bike and keep a full combustion engine in the F4.

Am i missing something here? I mean lets face it F4 sales are down cause mv never produced a good enough bike thats a fact and even myself who would buy every single F4 can say that. So for me the question of sales is a direct relation to the product it wasnt compariable to other bikes buy a long shot in my eyes it was left to die with no attention

So i ask all of the mvagusta.net community please write your comments below and lets me know what your thoughts are cause we are the consumer we need to be heard


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#2 ·
I rather like the idea of a hybrid....especially if it's used to make it go faster instead of environmental reasons (yes I know I may get flamed for that statement).

I think electric will be the future so like every business model it needs to adapt to current climate to survive - grassroots level example is the local pubs here in rural UK during the lockdown - they now do takeaway lunches / meals to keep afloat, as their industry will be the last to re-open here.

That's not to say I agree with electric vehicles (I've said for years nuclear power is best way to produce domestic energy as it yields so much from so little), but I obviously go against the grain. I don't have a solution to the problem of finite oil reserves and an exponentially expanding human population (well, I do but it's not accepted in an educated society), but something has to give and if that means MV make something other than an internal combustion engine to ride then so be it, I'd rather than than nothing at all.
 
#4 · (Edited)
I also am saddened by this. I agree with your statement. The F4 is iconic and needs to stay that way. I would not be in the market for an electric F4. The F4 had a soul. Take that away and I would not be a buyer.
Andrew i feel the same way i have had this rather anxious feeling in my gut that the brand that i have so dear loved with a passion will just not be the same anymore


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#6 ·
Will Mv Agusta release an F3 950 soon and would that be enough to cover for the new F4 untill it's release. Re the F4 being electric if hybrid, if the planned release date is four years time there may be similar platforms released by other manufacturers to meet emission requirements.
 
#8 · (Edited)
I dont think a triple cylinder 950 with 180hp will be good enough to replace f4 we are talking about the superbike of the brand the pinnacle of the stable

Do you think ducati will replace the pannigale with an electric bike? Or hybrid even?

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#12 ·
Bombshell! (In a bad way)
I firmly believe we are the last generation to have vehicles with soul and passion combined with legendary heritage and history.
We are getting conned to believe that ethanol fuel is good, batteries are good and that the only future for the planet is to eat vegetables only so that we don’t fart and pollute the air. And by the way, speed kills, so they would mandate that we will get GPS equipped vehicles incapable of exceeding the speed limit.
Look for and watch the new Michael Moore you tube video that exposes a large part of the myth of renewable energy, and the big business hijack of this movement.

From what you are saying Sam, the new CEO wants to be the Tesla of the motorcycle world. As you say, he will be walking away from a very high percentage of the current MV customers, who will mostly be dead or dying in 20 years.
I suspect he is trying to attract the next generation, who generally have little to no desire to appreciate heritage and passion. Unless it does everything via an app, there is no interest.

One can only hope that the petrol producing countries and companies have some input, otherwise they will have nothing to sell.
 
#13 · (Edited)
Sam, you know my views, the F4 is the Icon and flagship, 5 years without an icon or flagship model is a long time. Bringing out another Brutale or Dragster with yet another bit of carbon just does not cut it. At best these are short lived fashion models.

Every brand needs an Icon and the F4 is just that, it’s the difference between style and fashion.

For me the F4 needs an update, clearly in time the industry will move towards electric and hybrid technology, do I think MV can lead the way, I doubt it. You know I love the bikes and brand, but just look at what was done (pre Timor) spec says quickshifter and blipper on your bike sir, only to find out there was not one. The resources required to make a new electric and or Hyrid, are clearly large and I'm not personally convinced MV can do this and deliver all of the key requirements, Style (easy for MV), but Handling, Performance, Technology, as light as it can be and Robustness all at the same time, forgive me but I am sceptical.

Look at the current F4, they relaunched in 2010 and 2013 yet persistent issues with design and backup.

There are some generic issues with the F4 which affect the user experience, although we chalk them up to being a ‘characteristic’

Clutch – Every bike you own you have to get used to, the F4 clutch was appalling, snatchy and unpredictable at launch, and every-one knows that, why no fix. So many reviewers said it was a great bike but, you can’t launch it. You can’t claim this as a characteristic it's a design fault, and its left to individuals to solve the design issue and get it working. If you are worried about warranty (I'm not as i don't trust the MV dealership network in the UK) you have to live with it for 2 or 3 years before you can do anything about it.

Rear Brake - Everyone knows the rear brake is form over function, it really needs to be fixed so it does not boil in traffic, so many owners of MV's complain about this, they are just not reliable the fluid becomes hygroscopic and then the brake is useless. I fully appreciate that the lines look smooth with the current arrangement, but it needs to be addressed or at least offer an option to switch to a thumb brake, or race rearsets with the master cylinder on. Would you accept an Audi RS8 with a hand brake that might or might not work?

Ride Height – (ok an experience not a technical issue) The silly thing that made me mad. You pay 20k to 30k for a bike and you can’t even adjust the chain as you need to correct the ride height. Not a problem but tell people this before they purchase the bike and many will add it to the bill. I bought mine out right and I would have purchased one instantly at the time or taken measurements.

I wouldn’t buy my F4 until I knew I could be 100% independent of MV for servicing and maintenance, given the issues with the dealer network and the history. I might add this is the same for all bikes I own. A hybrid F4 would make me nervous of having a bike that develops a fault and no one can fix, and takes ages to get it fixed by the factory.

You know I will do anything for the brand or another MV owner, and I hope that the F4 is revived as a petrol model much quicker than 5 years and then transition / develop an F4h and or F4e as time, technology and quality permits.

A new Petrol F4, short term

Clearly a new F4 takes some time and the engine is the current issue, but it could be updated. Here MV must break the current cycle of a special basically being a few bolt on bits, wheels etc and different colour bodywork and calling it a limited edition.

Assuming the Euro5 regs can be complied with and maintain the power ( yes not easy), then my hit list would be: ( in no order)

  • Much more advanced electronics, slide control etc, if MV can’t do this for a known platform, an E bike is a bigger task
  • Built in GPS and logging to dash or phone (if phone must be android and iphone)
  • Bluetooth link to the Dash to say you have missed a call or got a text
  • Pit lane limiter
  • launch control
  • Engine heater
  • The trellis frame is part of the DNA and I would love to see it remain
  • Suspension, I would say ditch the Marzocchi /Sachs and Ohlins, and go quality and race inspired. K-tech or Mupo would be a bold and I think a clear differentiation, break from the crowd.
  • Seat unit and sub frame would be nice if it was a stressed Carbon structure.
  • Drop the tank for mass centralisation i.e like the WSB, clearly this needs a swing arm and link change but we know what to do.
  • Clutch, no launch issues
  • Exhaust, we need a light weight system, it weights far too much and, in my opinion, causes issues being so high up as mass. The same goes for headers, the current F4 headers are a little 1990’s an R1 or GSXR would be lighter
  • A bigger radiator, there is room, and it would help with the heat issues
  • Quick release number plate hanger
  • Some storage space, the current F4 has no storage space. With the ABS, I can’t even put my phone under the seat.
  • Every bike gets a carpet and a cover. I don’t care about the carpet, but many do.
  • Oh and a clock, please please add a clock to the display, I have got into so much trouble with my wife due to losing track of time
Like I say I love MV and especially the F4, but please don't leave us 5 years with no F4, and I am worried about the large technology step, given MV's track record of delivery and quality. This is not meant to be negative.
 
#15 ·
Sam, you know my views, the F4 is the Icon and flagship, 5 years without an icon or flagship model is a long time. Bringing out another Brutale or Dragster with yet another bit of carbon just does not cut it. At best these are short lived fashion models.

Every brand needs an Icon and the F4 is just that, it’s the difference between style and fashion.

For me the F4 needs an update, clearly in time the industry will move towards electric and hybrid technology, do I think MV can lead the way, I doubt it. You know I love the bikes and brand, but just look at what was done (pre Timor) spec says quickshifter and blipper on your bike sir, only to find out there was not one. The resources required to make a new electric and or Hyrid, are clearly large and I'm not personally convinced MV can do this and deliver all of the key requirements, Style (easy for MV), but Handling, Performance, Technology, as light as it can be and Robustness all at the same time, forgive me but I am sceptical.

Look at the current F4, they relaunched in 2010 and 2013 yet persistent issues with design and backup.

There are some generic issues with the F4 which affect the user experience, although we chalk them up to being a ‘characteristic’

Clutch – Every bike you own you have to get used to, the F4 clutch was appalling, snatchy and unpredictable at launch, and every-one knows that, why no fix. So many reviewers said it was a great bike but, you can’t launch it. You can’t claim this as a characteristic it's a design fault, and its left to individuals to solve the design issue and get it working. If you are worried about warranty (I'm not as i don't trust the MV dealership network in the UK) you have to live with it for 2 or 3 years before you can do anything about it.

Rear Brake - Everyone knows the rear brake is form over function, it really needs to be fixed so it does not boil in traffic, so many owners of MV's complain about this, they are just not reliable the fluid becomes hygroscopic and then the brake is useless. I fully appreciate that the lines look smooth with the current arrangement, but it needs to be addressed or at least offer an option to switch to a thumb brake, or race rearsets with the master cylinder on. Would you accept an Audi RS8 with a hand brake that might or might not work?

Ride Height – (ok an experience not a technical issue) The silly thing that made me mad. You pay 20k to 30k for a bike and you can’t even adjust the chain as you need to correct the ride height. Not a problem but tell people this before they purchase the bike and many will add it to the bill. I bought mine out right and I would have purchased one instantly at the time or taken measurements.

I wouldn’t buy my F4 until I knew I could be 100% independent of MV for servicing and maintenance, given the issues with the dealer network and the history. I might add this is the same for all bikes I own. A hybrid F4 would make me nervous of having a bike that develops a fault and no one can fix, and takes ages to get it fixed by the factory.

You know I will do anything for the brand or another MV owner, and I hope that the F4 is revived as a petrol model much quicker than 5 years and then transition / develop an F4h and or F4e as time, technology and quality permits.

A new Petrol F4, short term

Clearly a new F4 takes some time and the engine is the current issue, but it could be updated. Here MV must break the current cycle of a special basically being a few bolt on bits, wheels etc and different colour bodywork and calling it a limited edition.

Assuming the Euro5 regs can be complied with and maintain the power ( yes not easy), then my hit list would be: ( in no order)

  • Much more advanced electronics, slide control etc, if MV can’t do this for a known platform, an E bike is a bigger task
  • Built in GPS and logging to dash or phone (if phone must be android and iphone)
  • Bluetooth link to the Dash to say you have missed a call or got a text
  • Pit lane limiter
  • launch control
  • Engine heater
  • The trellis frame is part of the DNA and I would love to see it remain
  • Suspension, I would say ditch the Marzocchi /Sachs and Ohlins, and go quality and race inspired. K-tech or Mupo would be a bold and I think a clear differentiation, break from the crowd.
  • Seat unit and sub frame would be nice if it was a stressed Carbon structure.
  • Drop the tank for mass centralisation i.e like the WSB, clearly this needs a swing arm and link change but we know what to do.
  • Clutch, no launch issues
  • Exhaust, we need a light weight system, it weights far too much and, in my opinion, causes issues being so high up as mass. The same goes for headers, the current F4 headers are a little 1990’s an R1 or GSXR would be lighter
  • A bigger radiator, there is room, and it would help with the heat issues
  • Quick release number plate hanger
  • Some storage space, the current F4 has no storage space. With the ABS, I can’t even put my phone under the seat.
  • Every bike gets a carpet and a cover. I don’t care about the carpet, but many do.
  • Oh and a clock, please please add a clock to the display, I have got into so much trouble with my wife due to losing track of time
Like I say I love MV and especially the F4, but please don't leave us 5 years with no F4, and I am worried about the large technology step, given MV's track record of delivery and quality. This is not meant to be negative.
Aron you know i respect everything you say and i agree with you. F4 has been englected thats why it hasnt done well thats why its sales doesnt represent its true potential to ditch it

Did you here why lamborghini stopped making tractors and started making cars .....


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#18 ·
Even if you don't have an opinion, tell him. Its all information, you need the passionate Yes's, No's and frankly not bothered too to create an informed feedback to the factory
 
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#19 ·
I purchased my first bike, a Honda CB175, in 1970. I vaguely recall some of the magazine and general talk then about these motors that 'rev their guts out' and the oppositions 'screaming two strokes'. Much of this came from owners of the 'traditional' BSA, Triumph, Norton, AJS, Vincent, Matchless, et al. Those bikes now survive only by the care of serious collectors, replaced by the (then) new era of 'Jap shit flooding the market'. I recall many such statements and put downs when I went to watch scrambles.

I make this long-winded intro as a preface to the well-worn cliche that we (as a race) do not adapt well to change. I accept there is a difference between the various types of combustion engine versus the electric bike, but my view is that the resultant shift in consumer acceptance will be the same.

As already stated by some members, there is a huge swell of opinion to ditch the highly polluting combustion engines from society. There are opponents who claim that there is more environmental damage in the harvesting and maintenance/disposal of batteries. I admit I am not well informed in that area.

My view is that I echo other members belief that MV is merely 'gearing up' for the new era (rather than creating it!) so they will be one or two steps ahead of market demand instead of miles behind as they had been over many years. I love my 1st gen F4, and treasure it not only for its pleasure, but what it stands for in motorcycling history. Many might say that iconic bike cannot be repeated in any future release. But never say never. I would NEVER have purchased a Triumph until the recent Daytona 765 Moto 2 grabbed all my senses and emotions. On that basis, I could be a future MV Agusta customer - if they produced something special. For me, an electric bike will never be 'special' although I do concede they might have their place - just not in my garage.

So, what faces MV is the question: can we sustain sales with an 'enthusiast's' bike that sells so poorly it has to be subsidised by other models? And therein lies the answer.
 
#20 ·
I am a fairly new MV owner, I have a 2004 B4. And it's the only bike I have ever owned. I love it. That said the future is coming and whether we like it or not, it electric. I think it's the right choice to launch their first hybrid/electric bike under the F4 badge. As you have all said it is an icon of the brand. For me the best approach would be a hybrid under the same style as the McLaren P1. That thing uses the electronic part to compensate for the drawbacks of the combustion engine. A bike can be the same. Let's be honest if your cruising along at motorway speeds have the smooth fuel efficiency of an electric motor has its appeal. Then when the road gets twisty the petrol kicks in.

That's my 2p worth anyway.
 
#23 ·
I am a fairly new MV owner, I have a 2004 B4. And it's the only bike I have ever owned. I love it. That said the future is coming and whether we like it or not, it electric. I think it's the right choice to launch their first hybrid/electric bike under the F4 badge. As you have all said it is an icon of the brand. For me the best approach would be a hybrid under the same style as the McLaren P1. That thing uses the electronic part to compensate for the drawbacks of the combustion engine. A bike can be the same. Let's be honest if your cruising along at motorway speeds have the smooth fuel efficiency of an electric motor has its appeal. Then when the road gets twisty the petrol kicks in.

That's my 2p worth anyway.
I like the P1 analogy good point. But having hybrid we compromise wieight and if its heavy it wont turn the best am i right?


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#24 ·
Sam, it takes me a while to form an educated opinion. My gut feeling is that we are doomed to electric vehicles because the general population is being conditioned to accept them as, and I hate this phrase as it is a conditioning tool. "The New Reality".

Will I buy one? Absolutely not unless it is the last vehicle on earth for me to go get life-saving treatment for my dying child.

Nuclear Power was once "Too Cheap to Meter" until it was vilified to the public. Now, Nuclear Power, at least in the USA, is dying one plant at a time when it is the greenest power on the planet. Oh, and safest too.

I only mention this because that is the power of misinformation.

The F4 is what brought me to MV Agusta. Granted, I was not a first-time rider, nor was I completely uneducated about the history of the marque; it was that damn sexy four pipe rear end and flowing lines that just screamed ICON.

Tough act to follow.

The marque was a beautiful exercise in how to reintroduce a very unique bike. Today, as others have mentioned, it is an exercise in gawdy excess: RUSH???

My opinions are not technical; they are emotional. Emotion is what drives a purchase like an MV Agusta. If you lose the passionate response then you will lose the sales, or you will sell to a market without appreciation and forgiveness....and you will gain a reputation for being unreliable, unresponsive, and unwilling to meet the customer's basic needs while shouting from the rooftops that "WE are the best"!

In the current generation, and the generations to come, there will be less need for individualism and less of an ability to retract from the masses as autonomous vehicles and electronically controlled highways become the norm. This will happen simply because people only want to be buried in a screen...tehy won;t want ot be bothered with "getting there".

Ok, outta my brain!

I would like to see an F4 that is combustion driven. I would like to see an F4 that is iconic in stature. I would like to see an F4 with MotoGP electronics that can be completely disabled.

On the hybrid subject: as a separate project it would be interesting. We are already, however, limited as to what we can do with the power we have. The question is to what purpose? It would be unusable on the street and untenable on the track except in the hands of a very skilled few.

Electric? Well, if a Tesla can't get through two states in the US without "stopping for lunch" how would I get out of my city to visit without carrying a spare battery? Not enough infrastructure to make that viable, That doesn't begin to address "why" most people ride an MV Agusta. It certainly isn't about "Environmental Responsibility"...not that Electric Vehicles are responsible...

If MV wants to become everybody's bike, then continue the path. If MV wants to hang on to its Premium Brand status, then fix the infrastructure, fix parts supply, support owners who want to buy MV branded gear worldwide (including us larger-than-the-rest-of-humanity US sized folks), and stop making excuses for things that don't work...like the 3 cylinder platform rear brake and sprag clutches and quick-shifters and valves....you know, support those who support you.
 
#26 ·
Sam, it takes me a while to form an educated opinion. My gut feeling is that we are doomed to electric vehicles because the general population is being conditioned to accept them as, and I hate this phrase as it is a conditioning tool. "The New Reality".

Will I buy one? Absolutely not unless it is the last vehicle on earth for me to go get life-saving treatment for my dying child.

Nuclear Power was once "Too Cheap to Meter" until it was vilified to the public. Now, Nuclear Power, at least in the USA, is dying one plant at a time when it is the greenest power on the planet. Oh, and safest too.

I only mention this because that is the power of misinformation.

The F4 is what brought me to MV Agusta. Granted, I was not a first-time rider, nor was I completely uneducated about the history of the marque; it was that damn sexy four pipe rear end and flowing lines that just screamed ICON.

Tough act to follow.

The marque was a beautiful exercise in how to reintroduce a very unique bike. Today, as others have mentioned, it is an exercise in gawdy excess: RUSH???

My opinions are not technical; they are emotional. Emotion is what drives a purchase like an MV Agusta. If you lose the passionate response then you will lose the sales, or you will sell to a market without appreciation and forgiveness....and you will gain a reputation for being unreliable, unresponsive, and unwilling to meet the customer's basic needs while shouting from the rooftops that "WE are the best"!

In the current generation, and the generations to come, there will be less need for individualism and less of an ability to retract from the masses as autonomous vehicles and electronically controlled highways become the norm. This will happen simply because people only want to be buried in a screen...tehy won;t want ot be bothered with "getting there".

Ok, outta my brain!

I would like to see an F4 that is combustion driven. I would like to see an F4 that is iconic in stature. I would like to see an F4 with MotoGP electronics that can be completely disabled.

On the hybrid subject: as a separate project it would be interesting. We are already, however, limited as to what we can do with the power we have. The question is to what purpose? It would be unusable on the street and untenable on the track except in the hands of a very skilled few.

Electric? Well, if a Tesla can't get through two states in the US without "stopping for lunch" how would I get out of my city to visit without carrying a spare battery? Not enough infrastructure to make that viable, That doesn't begin to address "why" most people ride an MV Agusta. It certainly isn't about "Environmental Responsibility"...not that Electric Vehicles are responsible...

If MV wants to become everybody's bike, then continue the path. If MV wants to hang on to its Premium Brand status, then fix the infrastructure, fix parts supply, support owners who want to buy MV branded gear worldwide (including us larger-than-the-rest-of-humanity US sized folks), and stop making excuses for things that don't work...like the 3 cylinder platform rear brake and sprag clutches and quick-shifters and valves....you know, support those who support you.
Chuck this is exactly why I started this thread we need this platform to be heard we are a large community on here and if we can voice our opinions and we can get them to MV we can help the company we love so much more

Im not saying no to electric im just saying keep it seperate the mclaren P1 is a whole car on its own





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#32 ·
Did MV Agusta reach its status back in the day by doing like everyone else? -- Why DID the "iconic" 1.st Gen. F4 come to life in the late 90'ies? -- Because someone was passionate about resurrecting an iconic marque, with an almost unique racing pedigree .. 37 almost consecutive World championships .. done by being at or on the cutting edge of technology at the time .. not by looking at making the brand a commercial success at the same time.

The "current" MV management is clearly trying to use this "iconic" history of the MV brand to create a commercial success.. This approach only very rarely creates something truly "iconic"

To create a truly "new" and "iconic" F4 for the electric future they will need to throw the book out of the window, and start all over, get into E-racing and build something that out-races all the other E-racers on the track -- This will require working with cutting edge battery-technology - fuel cells - ultra-light-weight composite materials Ultra-compact and light fuel-burning conversion systems, not traditional internal combustion engines .. New ways of constructing chassis, suspension and brake technology .. . They need to add the very best designers to "package" this into something that a younger generation will look at the same way that we looked at the F4 in 1999 ... That will be a tough act to follow ..
 
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#37 ·
Did MV Agusta reach its status back in the day by doing like everyone else? -- Why DID the "iconic" 1.st Gen. F4 come to life in the late 90'ies? -- Because someone was passionate about resurrecting an iconic marque, with an almost unique racing pedigree .. 37 almost consecutive World championships .. done by being at or on the cutting edge of technology at the time .. not by looking at making the brand a commercial success at the same time.

The "current" MV management is clearly trying to use this "iconic" history of the MV brand to create a commercial success.. This approach only very rarely creates something truly "iconic"

To create a truly "new" and "iconic" F4 for the electric future they will need to throw the book out of the window, and start all over, get into E-racing and build something that out-races all the other E-racers on the track -- This will require working with cutting edge battery-technology - fuel cells - ultra-light-weight composite materials Ultra-compact and light fuel-burning conversion systems, not traditional internal combustion engines .. New ways of constructing chassis, suspension and brake technology .. . They need to add the very best designers to "package" this into something that a younger generation will look at the same way that we looked at the F4 in 1999 ... That will be a tough act to follow ..
So what do you think should F4 be electric or hybrid? Or ahould that be a seperate bike? Mv has a great history of racing and we arent even doing that to funnel the racing tech into the bikes if we it did i dont think we would be having this convo the F4 would have been more successful. What do you think?


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#39 ·
I had a Chevy SS six speed manual. Land vehicle Vehicle Car Full-size car Mid-size car
Great car production discontinued.
I traded it for Chevy Volt another great car with the best dealership and warranty backing. Vehicle Car Mitsubishi outlander Minivan Hybrid vehicle


Again discontinued. This car is awesome. 52 mile electric range. Great for scooting around town. Low center of gravity. And for long trips had an 8 gallon fuel tank and gets about 50mpg. Again discontinued. And finally the MV F4 1078. Last iteration of a great motorcycle. If something dies let it lie. Don’t keep resurecting something that had its beautiful life.
When the motor law is passed. And it will. We will pull the blankets of our internal combustión beasts and be outlaws. Not us, but our grandchildren. So if the MV name wants to be around and financially sound my prediction as I gaze into my crystal ball is an Electric MV Agusta Il “Voltio”.
 
#41 ·
I had a Chevy SS six speed manual. Great car production discontinued.
I traded it for Chevy Volt another great car with the best dealership and warranty backing.

Again discontinued. This car is awesome. 52 mile electric range. Great for scooting around town. Low center of gravity. And for long trips had an 8 gallon fuel tank and gets about 50mpg. Again discontinued. And finally the MV F4 1078. Last iteration of a great motorcycle. If something dies let it lie. Don’t keep resurecting something that had its beautiful life.
When the motor law is passed. And it will. We will pull the blankets of our internal combustión beasts and be outlaws. Not us, but our grandchildren. So if the MV name wants to be around and financially sound my prediction as I gaze into my crystal ball is an Electric MV Agusta Il “Voltio”.
Natural life of a machine is fine, although the same name is used for many re-inventions just think of the cars like the M3 etc. We will need electric bikes, but the F4 does not need to die yet.
We need an icon, and yes enter the TT Zero with the aim of understanding the tech and develop from there.

I think we need the icon and a 5 year wait is too long with no Superbike. The electric bike should have a different name, and will come, I just don't see how MV can do this in 5 years and make it a superbike. We don't have the history of getting combustion technology and everything else correct on existing machines think of the F3 675 valve issues. So moving to a new technology is a big ask and if Ducati, Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki, Kawasaki, Aprilia, KTM etc are not scheduled to replace their Superbikes with electric models yet, you can either say they are not visionaries, or they understand the market, or they know the difficulty in pulling it off and don't think the tech is ready for a superbike just yet.
 
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#40 ·
Rcing is expensive and does it help develop road bikes? I think it's beneficial, but the other part of racing is the brand awareness and the fanaticism of supporters. I'm not saying fanboy stuff, remain objective, but my heart would skip each time Camier over took, praying for podium.

Plus I would love MV to re-enter the F4 in WSB, and if the blade is competitive too, I think @nigelrb would explode if the were both battling for a win.
 
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#44 ·
I think motorbikes will end up being "exotics" on the public roads -- Just like people will be allowed to keep their combustion engined "vintage" cars running "for leisure" - the same will happen to bikes ..

Zero emmision is 0 emission .. and the way it will go ... The way technology moves now I think Nuclear power will come back, but in a very different way .. all the old Nuclear tech has become so horribly expensive to maintain, due to all the safety issues, so the 1+Gigawatt huge complicated Nuclear plants will be replaced slowly by much smaller and cheaper AND safer molten salt reactors in the 200 -300 MW range.. (one of those will fit in a 20 foot container, just google "Seaborg Technologies")The demands for more electric energy will NOT (Can NOT) be met by "renewable" sources -- I personally think the main obstruction to Nuclear energy in the next decades will be the price .. Also the very large plants puts too much load on transmission systems - A distributed system is much more effective in meeting the increasing demand for charging stations for EVs and an electrified transport sector. (Trucks with electric rail support on the motorways )

At some point there will be a scientific breakthrough that will allow energy storage at a much higher density than conventional chemical battery tech .. Then the combustion engines will simply disappear.. just 10 years ago no one believed that recharging an EV even 20% could be done in anything less than hours ..

Of course Racing helps in developing road bikes, just like F1 has helped in the kind of tech that is used in cars.. But racing and winning races is more about "planting" the desire for a bike or a car in the mind of prospective buyers . . This is why you need to adapt that to the public you want to sell the bikes to -- If the trend moves away from "superbike" - start making and racing bikes in another field of motorsports .. Why not E-bikes? I do not think MV should try to build an electric or hybrid "F4" -- They will need to build something entirely new .. Something like a self supporting Carbon-fibre mono-chassis, that uses the outside geometry of the bike as the loadbearing structure .. With Electronics and electrics using state of the art technology, like adaptable circuitry printed/moulded into the chassis itself - Ultra-light weight electric motors built into the rear swingarm at the pivot point .. Electric brakes using eddy-current technology - using all available brake energy to send it back into the batteries.
It can be done -- it just takes imagination and research.. and the ability to free you mind from conventional thinking .. Imagine brakes not dependent on friction .. Engines with only 2 or 3 moving parts Geometry Adapting Electric suspension, that also regnerates energy -- coolant systems that change weight distribution when braking .. Sensor systems that helps the rider know precisely how the surface of the tyres move in relation to the road surface -- active aerodynamics -- The list is VERY long ..
 
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#45 ·
There is no such thing as Zero Emission. That is the fantasy sold to promote electric vehicles.
 
#46 ·
I think that combustion engines are on their way out, for the planets' sake. All vehicles will be electric and they will likely out-perform anything we have today. Just look at the moto e-cup. All of the manufacturers are looking at ebikes, they're just not announcing it. It sucks, but it won't be anytime soon and most of us will still have our bikes as they'll be grandfathered legal for the road.

And who knows, maybe the next F4 will be horrible, design wise. I was excited for Ducati's next bike after the 1098/848 series until I saw it. The Panigale's are just ugly in my opinion. No underseat exhaust, no single-sided swingarm (for the 899), no dry clutch. They removed everything that made the 916/1098 series sexy to me. So I bought an 848, painted it yellow, and waited until I could get the pinnacle of sex on two wheels. Now I ride an F4 that makes me smile every time I open the garage door and gives me an even bigger smile when I crack the throttle open. Except for the sound. It's so quiet with the stock exhaust and I miss my 748 growl. And I'm glad a couple of people have mentioned the clutch issues; I thought it was just me. :)
 
#47 ·
All the manufacturers are working on electric bikes (and cars)....but energy storage technology is the limiting factor and must come first.
I will be very disappointed if a truly new "F4" doesn't come (with a traditional ICE power plant...or maybe a hybrid using F1 KERS type)....but then, I have my old F4 and have no plans to sell it. And I am in that age group that won't be buying anyway.....I can't use all the power and capabilities that I have now .

It is a tough business MV is in..... the customer is fickle and demanding and the support network (dealers) are in even worse positions.

Lets face it... MV is a boutique brand and will likely never be anything more. Scarce representation, poor after sales support...... the only thing going for the brand is the exotic moniker and exclusivity image.

So Timur SHOULD bring a new F4, built to order for the few who can pay and presented to the public as a "you can't have one" product..... and make it's cash flow money with the smaller capacity cheaply made bikes already in the pipe line now.....to include a stand alone electric bike for the commuter when everyone else is also making one.
But certainly not a "Flag Ship" electric superbike
 
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#48 · (Edited)
One can not will a vision, one should not confuse vision with a market-driven approach, one should not USE heritage as a prop. And as consumers and enthusiasts we can say whatever we like to say, we are on the outside reacting. It's not our money. The myth of MV is in our beings as we work on, ride, and share our experiences. Should that myth seem appealing going forward with new products, with a new direction then so be it... No live IG conversation will bring that to reality faster. Frankly, I think those IG sessions are a fool's game and foreshadow a lost brand, it is not transparency, it's fishing for new customers at the expense of its own purchased heritage. I'd like to see a final cream of the crop, sophisticated yet incredibly streamlined F4 as a summation of this epoch. As a vision, as ART. The final F4. Then reveal other power sources as an immediate followup. This shit needs reality, vision, hope, and some balls not just yammering PR.
 
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#52 ·
One can not will a vision, one should no confuse vision with a market-driven approach, one should not USE heritage as a prop. And as consumers and enthusiasts we can say whatever we like to say, we are on the outside reacting. It's not our money. The myth of MV is in our beings as we work on, ride, and share our experiences. Should that myth seem appealing going forward with new products, with a new direction then so be it... No live IG conversation will bring that to reality faster. Frankly, I think those IG sessions are a fool's game and foreshadow a lost brand, it is not transparency, it's fishing for new customers at the expense of its own purchased heritage. I'd like to see a final cream of the crop, sophisticated yet incredibly streamlined F4 as a summation of this epoch. As a vision, as ART. The final F4. Then reveal other power sources as an immediate followup. This shit needs reality, vision, hope, and some balls not just yammering PR.
Would you own an electric f4 or even buy one?


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#50 ·
George you are right. Guys please keep to the topic. Its not about mvs vision or anything else its about a product that is the pinnacle of MV like i said before i know electric is blund o happen but in 5 years have a elecric or hybrid f4? Why not make a electric mv and keep f4 seperate? Who would buy an ecrtic F4?


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#55 ·
They must start with an electric Cagiva mito , make it look like the SP 500 from way back and have a naked version too. People are not going to jump in their masses to new very expensive things before they acclimatize to the technology. I would consider an electric Mito as a town run around, but not a chance for an F4. Especially not at the money they are thinking. Also the technology of the future is unknown. Lithium batteries are not exactly "green" if you see where lithium comes from. We might have artificial carbon neutral fuels like Audi's e-benzin made with renewable energy so who knows.
 
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