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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
wondering if anyone has had the problem of expanding gas tanks using ethanol enriched gas?

basically do the brutales and the f-4 use the type of gas tanks that are plastic covered by a plastic outer aesthetic skin? or are they completely metal?

basically with the new ducati and other brands the plastic tanks are reacting to the ethanol in gas in the US.

the tanks deform and expand from absorbing the water from the ethanol that it absorbs from the air. basically people have bee reporting this happens in as little as 6 months but usually within 1-2 years of purchase.

has this happened with anyone here?

are the new brutales plastic or metal tanks?
 

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The 2000 - 2009 F4's have metal tanks. The fuel line quick connects underneath, however.....
 

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Easy fix is to use premium fuels instead of cheaper options as these are the ones with higher ethanol additive
 

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The 2000 - 2009 F4's have metal tanks. The fuel line quick connects underneath, however.....
Brutale's have plastic tanks, but i have not heard of any damage or collapsing.

Easy fix is to use premium fuels instead of cheaper options as these are the ones with higher ethanol additive
The ethanol percentage is irrespective of octane rating, though it does vary by county and/or season--Check the labels on your local pumps.

FYI, the US is planning to allow up to 15% ethanol for '09 vehicles and up, so watch what you're putting in your tank because this WILL destroy engines not ready for it.

Let's all burn our food, that's the way to save the world.
 

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Does anyone still supply non ethanol gas? Damned if I can find it.

If you think ethanol is trouble for plastic tanks be thankful you don't own an older Bertram boat. The fuel tanks are a moulded part of the hull, can't be replaced and the ethanol is dissolving the resin.

This entire ethanol business is a major bunch of bullshit. Using corn for fuel ends up costing us more in the long run when you tally your grocery bills now vs pre ethanol. Bunch of crap if you ask me.
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
Easy fix is to use premium fuels instead of cheaper options as these are the ones with higher ethanol additive
but there is no guarantee that even 93 or 95 pump gas will be ethanol free in the United States, none at all.

and ethanol free gas is damn near impossible to find anymore.

talked to one dealer and they said they are offering a service to coat the inside of the tanks that avoids the tank from absorbing the water and that it has been working for a couple of years, but no long term (obviously) assessment is done yet.

if mv has only started doing plastic tanks they may or may not start to crop up after some time in the next year or so.
 

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Does anyone still supply non ethanol gas? Damned if I can find it.

If you think ethanol is trouble for plastic tanks be thankful you don't own an older Bertram boat. The fuel tanks are a moulded part of the hull, can't be replaced and the ethanol is dissolving the resin.

This entire ethanol business is a major bunch of bullshit. Using corn for fuel ends up costing us more in the long run when you tally your grocery bills now vs pre ethanol. Bunch of crap if you ask me.
There's also no environmental benefit--Adding up the total carbon output for each process, and dino-oil is actually cleaner than corn-derived.
Add to that the fact the UN world food program has had to reduce their rations by 50% directly related to plant-based fuel consumption and it becomes purely unconscionable, deplorable behavior to even consider perpetuating this massive lie and enormous drain on the US economy.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
i see that this might turn into a political arugment for and against ethanol. that wasn't the point

the fact is that in the US non ethanol gas is extremely hard to find unelss you are willing to pay a massive premium for "race fuel" which for some of us is not economically feasible for everyday or even weekend riding.

and yes the US is considering allowing up to 15% in gas to be ethanol thus compounding the problem for regular gas engines not designed for ethanol (read anything that is not a flex fuel vehicle)

its not a matter of buying expensive or cheap gas, its a matter of hopefully the mv tanks are not made of a plastic that is effected by the ethanol or not.

has anyone run into any problems with the lines int eh tanks being destroyed by the ethanol or the tank expansion issue?

that is what i'm more curious about, not so much the political banter about "green tech" or whatever, that is another thread.
 

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OK, guys...here ya go.....find your station at this site:

http://pure-gas.org/

And, yes, ethanol reduces power, so you get fewer miles per gallon...yep, that's what I call environmentally smart.

The marine industry is really up in arms over the E15 madness....

I also recommend this stuff:

http://mystarbrite.com/startron/
 

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Discussion Starter #10
just what i thought nothing even remotely around me for hundreds of miles.

and the additive is great if you don't ride much or if you store your bike over the winter,but obviously its very cost prohibitive especially with mv's getting basically terrible gas mileage.
 

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Actually...the StarTron is added in very small amounts and improves running performance. It is not just a stabilizer for storage. Very inexpensive in reality.

Developed for the marine industry when the appearance of E10 gas started causing massive engine failures.

I run it in all my bikes. I will swear the fuel mileage has improved.
 

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I thought the appearance of the E10 gas was due to politicians paving there way through the Iowa caucuses.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Actually...the StarTron is added in very small amounts and improves running performance. It is not just a stabilizer for storage. Very inexpensive in reality.

Developed for the marine industry when the appearance of E10 gas started causing massive engine failures.

I run it in all my bikes. I will swear the fuel mileage has improved.
i understand that it may not be a lot to add each time, but if you use the bike for thousands of miles a year, adding an additive on each fuel up is not only a pain but will add to the cost that shouldn't be there.
 

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Ethanol is shit - period. Coincidentally, that matches what the legislators are using to power their decsion making processes.
 

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I recently was on a ride and saw the normal low grade gas with ethanol, but the high octane gas was specifically referred to as "recreational fuel" and noted that it was ethanol free. It was at a "Kwik Trip" gas station in Wisconsin, but when I subsequently went to another Kwik Trip they didn't have the same note there on the high octane stuff. I haven't had a problem with the MV, but I also ride vintage bikes and am always looking for ethanol free stations. That puregas website is great and I am going to send it to all of my friends and have them add any stations they know of. Thanks!
 

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I live in IA and ethanol free gas is readily available here. Most stations carry three grades of gas with one usually being e10. In IA the state tax on E10 is 10cents per gallon less than straight fuel to promote its use.
 

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I coated the inside of one of my Alu tanks with a sealer which is alchohol based I believe. That Star Tron get along with it? I'm going to start using it, pita that it is.
 

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Yes, the ethanol ate the fuel lines inside my tank. But not until around 16,000 miles. The fittings on the bottom I had already switched to brass.
 

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The ethanol percentage is irrespective of octane rating, though it does vary by county and/or season--Check the labels on your local pumps.
I never mentioned anything about octane ratings did I?

I said that by using a premium fuel you will get less ethanol content in it as that's part of the reason you pay more for it.

Some are nitrogen enriched to allow the fuel to burn cleaner.

Some have diferent friction modifiers to assist lubrication between the piston rings and the cylinder. The idea behind this is to allow the engine to transfer a bit more energy from the fuel as it will turn a bit more freely thus giving the impression of more power. Plus with less rolling friction the vehicle will give better fuel ecconomy.

Here In the UK our petrol must meet the minimum Brittish and European standard BS:EN 228 for regular or BS: 7800 for super unleaded higher octanes. To conform to these standards any petrol must contain no more than 5% ethanol.

Governments, fuels producers, vehicle manufacturers have known about the corrosive qualities of ethanol for quite a while. I would think that newer vehicles should be ok but anything before 2000 may suffer as a result.

As long as the Ethanol content doesn't increase to far we should be ok.
 

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I never mentioned anything about octane ratings did I?

I said that by using a premium fuel you will get less ethanol content in it as that's part of the reason you pay more for it.

Some are nitrogen enriched to allow the fuel to burn cleaner.

Some have diferent friction modifiers to assist lubrication between the piston rings and the cylinder. The idea behind this is to allow the engine to transfer a bit more energy from the fuel as it will turn a bit more freely thus giving the impression of more power. Plus with less rolling friction the vehicle will give better fuel ecconomy.

Here In the UK our petrol must meet the minimum Brittish and European standard BS:EN 228 for regular or BS: 7800 for super unleaded higher octanes. To conform to these standards any petrol must contain no more than 5% ethanol.

Governments, fuels producers, vehicle manufacturers have known about the corrosive qualities of ethanol for quite a while. I would think that newer vehicles should be ok but anything before 2000 may suffer as a result.

As long as the Ethanol content doesn't increase to far we should be ok.
In the US "premium" fuel is higher octane, most pumps have 'regular', 'plus', and 'premium', or some similar equivalent.
Regardless, 5% or 10% is still 5% and 10% no matter how much you're paying for it.
 
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