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Dragster RR
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi

I will try to make this short.

My 2016 Dragster hasn’t been starting very well recently and cut out twice so I thought maybe needs a new battery.

It’s the original battery and charger (MV tender) I believe, as I know the bike hasn’t been touched.

I assumed it was a wet or gel/agm battery and not a Lithium. So I purchased a new gel unit.

I just took the tank off to have a look and change it, and it is indeed a lithium, and when I press the status button all lights up fine?

Questions:
I figure I now need to replace it with another lithium and sent the gel back?
Would you assume the battery is in fact not faulty as the lights all come on, or could it still be faulty?
The charger I have (MV) must be for lithium too?

Hood Motor vehicle Car Electrical wiring Auto part
Motor vehicle Electrical wiring Auto part Cable Wire
Automotive tire Bicycle handlebar Yellow Bicycle accessory Automotive lighting
Automotive tire Tire Bumper Automotive exterior Bicycle part

Regards
 

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I am pretty certain the standard mv charger is not compatible with lithium batteries.
...so how can a standard motorcycle electrical system be compatible, then?
 

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Old Wing Nut
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You could use the AGM battery if you want.
Lithium batteries do not perform well when cold. What ambient temperatures have you had lately?
To get proper staring performance you may need to turn on the lights for some minutes to work the battery and get it warmed up internally before starting.
That and check your battery ground cables for clean and tight connection (maybe upgrade to a heavier cable).
A proper load test will tell you if the battery is toast. Unloaded voltage test (your status lights on the battery) don't tell the whole story.
 

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Dragster RR
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Yes I agree, and it has been cold here recently, hence why I was going to change it.

Has anyone else got a bike from this age (2016) with a lithium fitted from new?

Reading what's on here I assumed the charger is no good for Lithium.

I do have a the gear to test it, so that the next move when I get time. Saying that I am not sure if normal (wet/Gel) kit is good for testing Lithium?
 

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Dragster 800rr 2021
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I had put a Lithium on a 16 plate bike (aftermarket battery) never ever charged it or had a problem in the cold, only recently sold that bike.
I had heard about the lights trick for use in cold weather also.
Is the bike outside stored? Mine was garaged so not exposed to super cold, south east uk. But wouldn’t think it’s been cold enough yet to effect.
 

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Dragster RR
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Mine is inside too and always has been, but has been pretty cold here. Of course it could be another issue I guess.
 

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I changed my 2015 original battery to a lithium in 2016. The standard MV charger does NOT cater for lithium batteries. When charging a standard AGM battery the chargers have a desulphation phase where it 'overcharges' the battery to burn off sulpher from the anodes inside. You cannot do this with a lithium battery that is of a different design. You can also just still fit your new battery - that will work with your charger. Both types of battery will work in a bike, with pro's and con's to both. Lithium tend to lose less charge over time if left and weigh a lot less.

When the lithium is very cold you need to 'warm it up' to get better current draw from it. I tend to switch on my heated grips and headlight for 5 to 10 minutes - the current draw chemical reaction will 'heat' up the battery and increase it's available amp draw.
 

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Also - just to note - different batteries require different charge strategies / stages to optimise the charge. The latest chargers all have inbuilt algorythms to cater for this. The MV charger will charge the lithium, as will the bikes electrical system, it's just best practice to optimise battery life / performance with a suitable charger
 

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Old Wing Nut
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I would think that if the bike was equipped with a Li battery from the factory then the included charger would be appropriate for that battery.
The old MV provided tenders are not as good as the modern products, but that charger you have is not like the old black cubes from first gen bikes.
Get one of these...they do everything, work with any type battery (lithium included) and are priced quite reasonably.
Noco Genius
 

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Dragster RR
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Interesting and thank for all your input, much appreciated.

I am beginning to think 2016 Dragsters did not come with Li battery's and this must have been fitted and the old charger still used. Which may have caused damage or its an age thing.
As it looks like it been there a while.

When I get time (possibly tomorrow) I will take another look and test it. But I may fit the new battery anyway and try it, see how it feels...
 

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I will tell you unequivocally that the 2016 bikes did not come with a factory installed Lithium battery.
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Okay I have changed to battery and I have looked into this.

Yes, you are correct (not that I doubted anybody) these bikes did not come with a Li battery. So in my case it must have been changed when new, before me (I got it with 530 miles). So that’s answered.

Also it looks like they are still selling that charger so I contacted the supplying dealer and the maker of the charger. They both say that charger is NOT for Li battery’s. So that’s answered.

Anyway, I tested the old battery and it seems okay. But I thought I would replace with the new Gel battery anyway (the Li is much lighter though). Then I can also use the MV charger as well me thinks.

So then started the bike and it was just the same as the old battery!
Didn’t want to start, seems to turn over okay but will only fire if I just open the throttle. Then all is good and no problems.

After I warms up its all fine and useable. But I will need to look into this as a different fault, or is this normal when very cold?

Its snowing here and about 0 degrees, so I am not going anywhere on the bike for a while anyway😞

I may refit the Lithium battery too.

So I think maybe a coolant sensor could be the next step.

Also this is post-accident (bike written off and repaired) and there is a possibility something was damaged in the smash maybe.
 

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There is an air temperature sensor in the air tube that adjusts fueling. If this is not working, coldxararrs will be difficult
 

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...so how can a standard motorcycle electrical system be compatible, then?
It's not about the charge the battery puts out.
It's about the input needed to charge the battery up properly. Different chemistry to lead acid batteries and needs different charge rate etc.
 

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It's not about the charge the battery puts out.
It's about the input needed to charge the battery up properly. Different chemistry to lead acid batteries and needs different charge rate etc.
Ah
I see what you mean. U mean the charging system (regulator/rectifier) on the bike which charges it when running?
Good point. Don't know.
But I do know your typical lead acid battery charger ain't proper for a lithium battery and won't charge it to max potential.

I think lithium needs a stronger input to charge it - maybe the regulator on the bike kicks out a higher voltage than your typical battery charger?
 

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Dragster RR
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Ya they need higher input, but the bike system is okay.

You cant test them with normal battery tester either. But they are okay with some older load testers, assuming it can be adjusted down for a bike battery.

I will look into the air temp sensor next.

Thanks again
 

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Old Wing Nut
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Does your bike have a "Fast Idle" lever on the throttle side for cold starts? Some call it a "choke" but it actually cracks open the throttle just a bit for cold starting ... when the cables are correctly adjusted.
Sounds like just what you are doing when you open the throttle and then it starts..??!!
 

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Old Wing Nut
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I thought its fly by wire and no cable.
Ah yes.... I keep forgetting. That's what happens when you've lost a lot of brain cells over the decades.
In that case, the ECU should bump the throttle for cold starts.... so it starts easily if you open the throttle slightly and then everything is OK ?? And idle is normal when running?
Hmmmm
 
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