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Unloved Balls:

DSC_2601r.jpg
 

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New Tapered:

DSC_2614r.jpg
 

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Granted, the above was applied to my Monster rebuild; however, it applies to your MV...any MV.
 

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Race bikes use ball's in most cases, and throw them out after every weekend Chuck. Top teams use ceramics, not touching that though .
Tapered bearings needs to be pre-torqued to spec, and you will love em forever after, with a tweak after a few laps.

They feel good, give constant feedback...........
 

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It's called $$$$$ Chuck.
And properly maintained ball bearings last a looong time.

Some bikes get tapered bearings from the factory, usually heavy weights.
Suzuki shifted from balls to tapered on its VL1500 cruiser, mid way through that model's life, as a result of customers complaining of head shake when they let go of the handlebars under decel. Not really a "problem" (don't let go of the bars!), but the added friction of the tapers was all it took to quell the shake.

And there is the reason our high end MVs got ball bearings.....friction. (Also weight, albeit minimal).
 
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The issue I have had over the years was the ball bearings will "dent" the races, ........OK from wheelies.
Then the bike can "head shake" at speed as the balls want to ride in the dents.
My Kawasakis, Hondas and Suzukis were all changed to tapered roller head bearings. I intend to change the MV to them also.
Ball bearings usually have no play (set and done) and are well suited for high speed. The tapered rollers actually reduce overall contact by spreading the load along the bearings and not concentrating it at the balls contact point. And the tapers do require periodic adjustment.
With modern front brakes some pretty large axial loads can be introduced during hard braking, no to mention wheelies!
Plus for most factory installs, the ball bearings are just much cheaper and easier to install......................

Just my 2 cents.

Ed S :)
 

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Gearhead said:
Plus for most factory installs, the ball bearings are just much cheaper and easier to install......................
:)
And there you have it.
 

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wtf????

Where in the hell do you folks come up with all this BULLSHIT?????

Yes, ball bearings are cheaper.......and aren't worth a fuck either, they take impact in a straight line that's why they pound out
tapered bearings are at an angle so the can't pound out

I use the same tools for both....a SnapOn CJ 951 bearing separator to remove the inner race and Park Tool RT 2 to remove the outers it's a bicycle tool
the bearing separator will remove the inner, the Park Tool removes the outers with 1 tap of a mallet

Increased friction? really? how much do you turn the bars while riding? got a steering damper?

Adjusting tapered bearings......YOU DO NOT TORQUE THE BEARING!!!!!! ever work on the front wheel of a rear wheel drive car or truck?
you seat the bearing by going a little past 1st contact, then back it off, then with YOUR FINGERS UNTIL CONTACT THEN BACK OFF TO THE
1ST COTTER PIN HOLE AND INSTALL THE PIN
On steering heads go finger tight and clamp it down....

In front of me the Timken Journal, Machinery's Handbook and Perry's Engineering Manual

Braking loads are nothing.......look at the area of the front tire contact patch ......AGO raced with 1 disc why do you have 2?
You faster than AGO?


Didn't think so

:popcorn:
 

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Where in the hell do you folks come up with all this BULLSHIT?????

Yes, ball bearings are cheaper.......and aren't worth a fuck either, they take impact in a straight line that's why they pound out
tapered bearings are at an angle so the can't pound out

I use the same tools for both....a SnapOn CJ 951 bearing separator to remove the inner race and Park Tool RT 2 to remove the outers it's a bicycle tool
the bearing separator will remove the inner, the Park Tool removes the outers with 1 tap of a mallet

Increased friction? really? how much do you turn the bars while riding? got a steering damper?

Adjusting tapered bearings......YOU DO NOT TORQUE THE BEARING!!!!!! ever work on the front wheel of a rear wheel drive car or truck?
you seat the bearing by going a little past 1st contact, then back it off, then with YOUR FINGERS UNTIL CONTACT THEN BACK OFF TO THE
1ST COTTER PIN HOLE AND INSTALL THE PIN
On steering heads go finger tight and clamp it down....

In front of me the Timken Journal, Machinery's Handbook and Perry's Engineering Manual

Braking loads are nothing.......look at the area of the front tire contact patch ......AGO raced with 1 disc why do you have 2?
You faster than AGO?


Didn't think so

:popcorn:
Well you're wrong !
I'll tell you what I found installing these taper bearings on MV's and my mates CBR1000.
When I used your method, which you supplied in your same rude fashion, we did all of 5 laps before it felt like the front was going the chatter to pieces.
Came into pits and then used the method of tightening up the bearings as per MV manual, this method seemed to work better but still ended up having play by the end of the day. I then added another 30 degrees worth of tension to the steering and that seemed to work, if I went as far as 45 degrees the steering started tightening up.

I think you're rude, and although I have a lot of respect for your past experience, I think you're being left behind by new technology due to your own arrogance in thinking that you know everything, or you inability to compare the current with the past, and it's a shame to see.:crying:
To compare Ago, and the bikes he rode, with today's riders and their bikes is an insult to all parties involved, I wonder when was the last time you actually watched a season of MotoGP's and WSB racing, not recently I'm sure.
:stickpoke
 

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Hi there,

The taper roller bearings have a higher contact patch than the taper ball bearings. I would look to change to them if I had to replace head bearings as well.

Do you have the bearing numbers? Could be useful for people who come across this post in the future.
 

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Hey Dons

I was asking you as you said that you had installed two taper roller bearings. Thanks for the link, that cleared it up. Fitted a fair few bearings in my time, including some big ones attached to ships.:grin2:
No worries Graham.
It's good practice to name someone for future reference, my mind reading skills are dwindling to say the least :crying::laugh:
 

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????

Well you're wrong !
I'll tell you what I found installing these taper bearings on MV's and my mates CBR1000.
When I used your method, which you supplied in your same rude fashion, we did all of 5 laps before it felt like the front was going the chatter to pieces.
Came into pits and then used the method of tightening up the bearings as per MV manual, this method seemed to work better but still ended up having play by the end of the day. I then added another 30 degrees worth of tension to the steering and that seemed to work, if I went as far as 45 degrees the steering started tightening up.

I think you're rude, and although I have a lot of respect for your past experience, I think you're being left behind by new technology due to your own arrogance in thinking that you know everything, or you inability to compare the current with the past, and it's a shame to see.:crying:
To compare Ago, and the bikes he rode, with today's riders and their bikes is an insult to all parties involved, I wonder when was the last time you actually watched a season of MotoGP's and WSB racing, not recently I'm sure.
:stickpoke
Donsy:
Try installing the tapered bearings according to a bearing manual!!!
In your link you advised to be sure to get the shield..... that's more than likely your problem
the steering stem isn't square to the bearing cartridge.... I've installed 100s without a problem
you're doing something WRONG

the steering stem didn't get longer
the bearing cartridge didn't get shorter think about it
more torque is not how you fix it

So what technologies did I miss???
hopefully you don't think tapered steering head bearings.....
when nobody used them, FW Egli did starting in '65, on the swingarm too and the adjustment nuts on the swingarm are welded to keep mechanics from screwing it up

try READING what I typed about AGO

FW Egli was born in '37, in 2009 he went to Bonneville went 209.440mph against MVs 185.882
yes folks he went 24mph faster ....WITH A SIDEHACK!!!!!
Last year Fritz took a '30s Egli-Vincent Comet 500 single to the TT, Horst Saiger did a lap of the Snaefell in 21:50.9
against John Surtees '60 MV 4's 21:45......Horst rode the pants off it LOLOL
 

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I spose you don't get point loading at the race to bearing contact point must help both mechanically and maybe to keep the grease film even over the race to bearing contact point with a taper roller bearing..

In fitting them recently I remember on my 1975 Beemer tightening the bearing nut to finger tight..nipping it about 5deg further, backing the nut off and then tightening finger tight..

I kept an eye on them and they don't slacken off and the bars move freely.

For the average rider it's probably more important to service the bearings periodically by cleaning and regreasing than the choice between taper roller and oe balls.

I've seen quite a few steering heads off MVs with dried up / hardly any grease in them.

Bikes that have an earth/gnd point in the headlamp shell and going to earth through the bearings isn't a brilliant idea either..

Joe
 
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