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Discussion Starter #1
anyone know here what the dealer invoice or dealer cost on each one of these bikes are?

basically want to know what to negotiate toward from msrp.

do the dealers make a lot off these bike or not? for exampel the 1090 msrp is 18k US dollars is the dealer getting these for 15 or 16k or even less?

if you want just pm me or post up curious as to what room is availabe on these bikes.
 

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Do you want a dealer to be around to work on your bike after you buy it? They need to make money to do this, otherwise theyll close up shop like a ton of other places have.

Look for around 3-4% discount, this way you win, and they can still pay the light bills.
 

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Most motorcycles have about a 15% margin for the dealer. Some brands have less, a few slightly more.

I'll give you a real world number: $11,999 MSRP bike. Dealer Net Invoice $10,235, which includes $275 freight, but not assembly and prep.

The dealers do get some advertising co-op monies and other retail incentives and such, but not as much as you might think.

That is a number for a Japanese manufacturer. I have been told the European bikes have a smaller margins.

Document fees are one of the biggest profit center the dealers have, but I'll be damned if I could ever get them to deal on that (some legal "must charge" mumbo jumbo...maybe Randarosa could enlighten us all?)

But the bottom line is this, the dealer has to make a profit or they will go out of business. They are not working as a charity. You should want the dealer to be profitable so he will invest in parts inventories and proper tools and quality technicians to support your purchase after the sale.

There aren't many MV dealers, and there aren't many MV bikes sold in this country. You want a strong successful dealer to take care of you in the future. You won't have one if he can't make a little money selling you a bike.
 

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There aren't many MV dealers, and there aren't many MV bikes sold in this country. You want a strong successful dealer to take care of you in the future. You won't have one if he can't make a little money selling you a bike.
Agreed +100 - i do some web-based marketing work with a Ducati/Triumph/Yamaha dealer here in NZ and they dont make that much that they can cut the guts out of prices. As above, i have no problem with "Cash deal", maybe get a bit off, but in the long run... if you dont beat the profit out of them, you will find that the dealer will be MUCH easier to deal with on-going.
 

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Well Mr Road Biking...I'll give you my halfpence worth ...

The dealer sales staff are professionals...and the reason they are paid is to get as much money out of you as they can...that is business...the fundamental purpose of any business is to make profit...They have the tools and training of doing what they do day in day out for years...The customer however is in effect a lamb to the slaughter he only occasionally moves into the Collesseum.

..In a nice fluffy kinda world you'll come across a nice friendly dealer who will give you the best deal straight off.It has to be said though that is their job to make you feel like you are getting the best deal while they are in effect getting the best deal for themselves. Some dealers will have the foresight to realize that volume deals at sensible returns are in the long term more profitable than quick killings because in making a quick killing they are actually killing future demand...
When you go in to buy a bike how do you know which you have..The answer is usually you don't...

So, armed with t he knowledge that the dealer is well and truly capable of looking after himself..and won't ever sell you a bike at a price disadvantageous to himself...look after yourself..

In the words of Burt Munro...Think of a ridiclously low price....then halve it...That's where you start from..
Do your research on what you are buying and the deal and all it entails..and counter each attempt by the dealer to raise the price with a weakness or problem with his offer to you....

and then when you have your deal ..ask for a free pair of gloves and helmet before you sign your life away....

Don't worry about the dealer's margin...let him do that,,,and ..he will !

good luck.

joe
 

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Some dealers will have the foresight to realize that volume deals at sensible returns are in the long term more profitable than quick killings because in making a quick killing they are actually killing future demand...
The only problem with that concept and MVs is there is no way any dealer can do high volume at low prices...not enough MV buyers, and not enough MV product...

Now if you want a Jap bike I can tell you where there are some crazy low prices....on non-current product.

The manufacturers have all recognized the market and economic situation and have cut production volume as a result. Suzuki did not even bring 2010 product to the US. They, as well as Honda, Yamaha and Kawasaki, have plenty of 2009 and 2008 to get rid of.

But MV only brings about 500 bikes a year to the US. Only a MV dealer looking to get out of the product line because of minimal sales possibilities will be giving them away. Doesn't mean you shouldn't try to negotiate the best price you can....but don't expect deals like the left over 2008 CBR1000RR for $8000 out the door (Yep...they had thousands of them to get rid of....pity the poor fellow who paid $11K+ just a few weeks before the price drop).
 

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Document fees are one of the biggest profit center the dealers have, but I'll be damned if I could ever get them to deal on that (some legal "must charge" mumbo jumbo...maybe Randarosa could enlighten us all?)
Your wish is my command........

I've been in the automobile business since 1976, and have been 'splaining doc fees since I had a full head of dark hair, and a 30" waist line.

When asked by a customer, "What's this here 'doc' fee?", I just tell them the truth. "It's additional dealer profit, some of which hits the bottom line (I hope) after I pay my tag lady, my Fed Ex bills, my admin lady, my copy machine lease, etc....."

I've sold a zillion cars, and answered that question half a zillion times. The truth goes a long way. Most customers, when presented the answer in that fashion, say OK. One other caveat when pressed: "Don't feel bad Mr. Customer, I charge everyone the same fee, even my employees. It's a cost of doing business at my dealership. If you'll check, you'll see that my doc fee is less than dealership X down the street."

I've NEVER removed the charge, and I can't remember the last time (if ever) it cost me a sale.
 

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One other thing........I used to strive to only loose $10,000 per month in the new car department at my dealership. Margins being what they are, no dealer is currently making a profit in his new vehicle department, unless he's selling BMW, Lexus, or Mercedes. Rare execeptions do exist, of course, but as a rule, you sell the car at a net loss, just to earn a new customer. Maybe you make some money in finance, or service/parts in the future, but not on the new transaction.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
thanks for the view from the other side.

i do appreciate any dealer that will make the effort to maybe give me a deal on the new vehicle sale, that way any savings i have at that moment will go toward the services to the future, and over the life of the product they are making back the loss in spades.

but hey that is how i work i could be wrong.

thanks for the input guys i do appreciate hearing about how both sides of the transaction works.
 

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Don't wish to get too heavy on this but the deal is on the table for both the seller and the buyer to negotiate. If I were a dealer I'd do realistic sales projections and pitch my gross profit to cover administrative costs and to give a net profit to the business. It's up to the seller to set out his stall. The buyer has a perfect right to make an offer.
I would imagine MV sales are tight as it's a slim Market. But what's wrong with a bit of negotiation. Both the dealer and the buyer can walk away from the deal.
In order to reach a successful outcome to a negotiation both parties have to be happy. The seller conceding
What he can at least cost to him and maximum advantage to buyer. Or deal sweetners.
 

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In order to reach a successful outcome to a negotiation both parties have to be happy........
.......no they don't Joe. I've paid too much and sold too cheap a zillion times. That didn't necessary make me happy, but I still made the deal.
 

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Document fees are one of the biggest profit center the dealers have, but I'll be damned if I could ever get them to deal on that (some legal "must charge" mumbo jumbo...maybe Randarosa could enlighten us all?)
On a used pickup we agreed on a price well below NADA + tax&title. When the paper work included $444 doc fee and I refused the deal they made the paperwork read $500 less with doc fee and slightly lower total. It must be pretty important to them. Maybe Randy can explain that. Incidentally, the saleman told me doc fees are a state law, I didn't believe him and he knew it.

On the other hand, when I tried to bargain on two 06 Brutales they both sold within a week. I jumped on the orange 08 without hesitation. Dealer service has been excellent including storage for two weeks (including riding gear) while out of town on several occasions. Saved on long term parking fees.

A truck is just a truck and I didn't need a newer one but I had to have the Brutale. Supply and demand. Capitalism and democracy. Love and marriage....ooops, went too far.
 

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in ohio doc fees can be up to 250, goes towards (at our dealership) keeping all the private information safeguarded for however many years we ahve to keep it along with what randy said
 

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I can tell you that the last 5 nissan's i sold at the end of last month, none of them had a positive gross
 

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Do you want a dealer to be around to work on your bike after you buy it? They need to make money to do this, otherwise theyll close up shop like a ton of other places have.

Look for around 3-4% discount, this way you win, and they can still pay the light bills.


+1 :drummer:
 

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Discussion Starter #18
well my dealer is doing a deal of invoice plus a couple of hundred, so i'm going for it, the "invoice" that he says his cost is, was the hopeful low end of where i thought i could get the bike for. so its basically the deal i was looking for without haggling, so i can't really complain.

don't really think there was too much wiggle room as out the door it would be around 12% off msrp so i guess that isn't too bad a deal, so i'm going for it afterall sometimes you just have to do the illogical thing and get what you want.
 

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I would say 12% off MSRP is pretty damn close to his cost.
 

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I would have to agree.
 
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