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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Cheers All,

This question is specific to 2008 910 Brutale owner with the O2 Sensor issue.

Has anyone on this site "actually" installed the full Arrow Thunder (shorty can with new Arrow header and midpipes) system on their 2008 Brute?

Did you get a new ECU (trade-in stock to FBF) reflashed to not recognize the O2 sensor? This about $500 to $700 depending who you speak with at Ferracci.

Or, did you drill a hole in the mid-pipe (do some minor welding) and then screw back in the O2 sensor...and go from there? I spoke with Greg at Arrow in Vegas and he mentioned that Arrow (Italy) will not be producing Thunder midpipes with drilled holes (for O2)...however, holes will be drilled for the Arrow stack exhaust....and the stacks are selling less vs. the Thunder in the US.

Anyone? Maybe I'm going to be the first for the 08 Brute and Arrow Full Shorty???...I've noticed others doing this with the full Corsa Ti exhaust and the FBF or MV race ecu.

Thx,

J
 

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I have the new o7 (uk) 910R ,i had the 06 headers and midpipe fitted and they had to get a new ECU and fit,and it runs a lot better than the 06.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
heno42666 said:
I have the new o7 (uk) 910R ,i had the 06 headers and midpipe fitted and they had to get a new ECU and fit,and it runs a lot better than the 06.
Thanks for the input.

Problem solved......spoke with Eraldo Ferracci this morning. Very nice, informative and supportive.

For the US 08 Brutales with O2 Sensors, you can exchange your stock ecu for the FBF ecu (for a price). Eraldo mentioned the FBF ecu will not recognize the O2 sensor and will be mapped for the Arrow Full Thunder system and all electronics will work correctly. He mentioned doing a number of these specific exhaust systems already. Eraldo is claiming between 10 and 15 extra ponies added to the Brute with this setup.

Will have the setup in about 2 weeks.
and can't wait.

Cheers and Happy Holidays,

John
 

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John, how did this turn out? I am thinking of getting a 2008 910R and I want to get the short exhaust as well. Did you get a high performance air filter as well?

-Brian
 

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Motovation has the Arrow Thunder with the slightly longer midpipe that now have a O2 sensor port installed. So they work fine for the 08 bikes but you will have to get the Arrow headers as well because the 08 bikes have the headers and the cat as one unit I believe. Recommended to install a PC3 to get the most out of what is technically a full system.
 

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Here's what I did

http://www.mvagusta.net/forum/showthread.php?t=16447

Not the Shorty, but same idea. I didn't have to retune and my bike runs fantastic, but I did have to reinstall the dB killers (more socially responsible, too). I know I will get better power with dB killers out but removing them means the fuel trim will need to be reset. So I'll do that later.

PC III will not work on latest Euro 3 spec ECU with oxygen sensor.
 

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I have all my bike pipes fitted with an 18mm bung for using my Wideband Commander. You can get any muffler shop to install one and either stick an old spark plug or a simple plug you can get at almost any outo parts store. The muffler shop may even have the plugs with a copper gasket. You can usually find the plugs in the oil drain plug section at auto parts stores.
I plug mine because once I get the A/F set with the Wideband Commander, I remove it because it's not needed anymore.
Dale McClure
 

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But the Wideband Commander WILL work and that's what is important. If you don't know your air/fuel, everything else is just guessing.
 

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John, how did this turn out? I am thinking of getting a 2008 910R and I want to get the short exhaust as well. Did you get a high performance air filter as well?

-Brian
Dick!
 

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John, how did this turn out? I am thinking of getting a 2008 910R and I want to get the short exhaust as well. Did you get a high performance air filter as well?

-Brian
I meant....wassup....Bri. I can't believe I ran across you on this site, 3,000 miles away....freagin hilarious. Love the swingarm on the bike....but.....get rid of the 1098 and buy the 1078 not the 910 and quit trollin. We don't need any Ducks here....just MV owners. Come visit soon so you can swap out my exhaust for me.

Cheers wanker,

T.
 

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I have an '08. Had to buy the arrow headers, midpipe (with oxygen sensor bung) and the pipe all together because of the 1 piece midpipe/header.

Sounds good, but with the baffle out, it has to be retuned. I think it's running lean.
 

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With the baffle out it is running lean. You think? Get a Wideband Commander or take it to a dyno with an operator who knows how to richen the computer.
Dale
 

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Some people aren't technologically inclined or have the time, experience, intuition, skills, etc to figure out the problem, much less the solution. I won't make any assumptions about what people do/do not know, since this is a forum... and not a conversation between people in a very specific context.

That said, I didn't assume that everyone in here knows that taking a baffle out may require that the engine be re-tuned due to an non-optimal air/fuel mixture. Some might know. Great. You don't need to know this information. But there are others who have yet to be enlightened by that tidbit of information. Isn't that what part of forum is about? To help those who need help?

Pat yourself on the back, since you provided some possible solutions to an engine that is running lean, which I had left out.

But you don't have to be a jerk about it with that "Duh!" tone.
 

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OK, here's your "Jerk" answer to your bike running like shit. If you have a 910R with the racing chip installled, there is a pot inside the cover of the computer. Adjust this pot in very fine increments to richen or lean your mixture. You will have to have a wideband O2 sensor to monitor the changes your are making. This means a dyno or a Wideband Commander. Both use the exact same wideband O2 sensor. By adjusting the pot in the computer you can fine tune your A/F ratio very easilly.

The technicians at your local MV shop will tap into the exhaust at idle with a CO meter, and set it to whatever the factory says to set it to. They are adjusting the very same pot described in the above paragraph.

My "Jerk" take is this, who gives a crap what the CO is at idle? All I care about is what the A/F ratio is at wide open throttle. Using your laptop along with a friendly Windows program is much more accurate and easy to use than that stupid pot in the bike's computer. Plus you get real time readings at every RPM level and you adjust it with your laptop instead of a non-magnetic pocket screwdriver. With the Wideband Commander used in conjunction with a Power Commander, this makes the pot in the computer useless and a moot point. Set it in the middle of it's range, put the cover back on the computer, and never touch it again.
Now get busy monitoring your Wideband Commander with your laptop and simply adjust the numbers on the Power Commander program, and then load it to the Commander box on the bike. If you mess up and go in the wrong direction it won't hurt your non turbo bike in any way whatsoever. The bike just won't run as good as it did before you screwed up.
I like to use an on /off switch mounted anywhere on the bike preferably on the handlebar somewhere. Any auto supply has this simple two pole on/off switch for about a dollar or less. The instructions that come with the Wideband Commander shows you how to wire this switch. Very simple stuff. I usually duct tape the switch on the handlebar because you are going to remove it when you get the A/F where you want it anyway.
Then, take the bike out and put it in fifth gear at about 25 MPH and flip the switch to "ON". Then hammer down and leave it there until about 110 MPH or about 10 seconds. Flip the switch to off and then go back to the house, plug in your laptop, and you can see right in front of your face what the A/F ratio was during the entire run. Again, adjust the Power Commander accordingly. Isn't this fun? You can see the progress you are making and in turn the bike keeps running better and better.

Note: trying to log your A/F ratio while shifting gears is more difficult to read your readings on the Wideband Commander run. As noted above, put the bike in one gear, any gear, to get about a full 10 second run. I use fifth gear but some may use fourth if you like. It doesn't matter as long as you have a full throttle 10 second run to look at on your laptop. When I was doing this on my turbo Hayabusa, holding it open in any gear for 10 seconds was very difficult and downright scary.

Any questions I will be happy to answer, in a "Jerky" way of course.

Dale "Jerk" McClure

Is namecalling OK within the rules of this messageboard?
 

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Come on Dale, I liked the 'Kinder, Gentler, Mad Man' of the last couple of weeks. :green: just kiddin Bubba...
 

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When I de-catted my 910R I had to put the dB killers back in my Arrow mufflers, too. It was definitely lean off idle where it had run perfect before with the cat in. But I don't mind 'cause the noise level went up a bunch when I put the new headers and mid-pipe on, and I am not into annoying the general public and attracting that much negative attention. It still sounds great with the baffles in, and about as loud as before with the cat and no baffles. Plus it runs like it did before I did all this...which is just perfect, by-the-way.
 

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The stock race pipes are are a whole lot louder than the Arrow with the DB killers in. I haven't run the Arrow without the DB killer yet. It would take a different Map and I'm putting that off for the time being.
The stock race mufflers require alot more fuel than the Arrow with the DB killer. And, the stock race mufflers sound a whole lot more badass than the Arrow.
 

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OK, here's your "Jerk" answer to your bike running like shit. If you have a 910R with the racing chip installled, there is a pot inside the cover of the computer. Adjust this pot in very fine increments to richen or lean your mixture. You will have to have a wideband O2 sensor to monitor the changes your are making. This means a dyno or a Wideband Commander. Both use the exact same wideband O2 sensor. By adjusting the pot in the computer you can fine tune your A/F ratio very easilly.

The technicians at your local MV shop will tap into the exhaust at idle with a CO meter, and set it to whatever the factory says to set it to. They are adjusting the very same pot described in the above paragraph.

My "Jerk" take is this, who gives a crap what the CO is at idle? All I care about is what the A/F ratio is at wide open throttle. Using your laptop along with a friendly Windows program is much more accurate and easy to use than that stupid pot in the bike's computer. Plus you get real time readings at every RPM level and you adjust it with your laptop instead of a non-magnetic pocket screwdriver. With the Wideband Commander used in conjunction with a Power Commander, this makes the pot in the computer useless and a moot point. Set it in the middle of it's range, put the cover back on the computer, and never touch it again.
Now get busy monitoring your Wideband Commander with your laptop and simply adjust the numbers on the Power Commander program, and then load it to the Commander box on the bike. If you mess up and go in the wrong direction it won't hurt your non turbo bike in any way whatsoever. The bike just won't run as good as it did before you screwed up.
I like to use an on /off switch mounted anywhere on the bike preferably on the handlebar somewhere. Any auto supply has this simple two pole on/off switch for about a dollar or less. The instructions that come with the Wideband Commander shows you how to wire this switch. Very simple stuff. I usually duct tape the switch on the handlebar because you are going to remove it when you get the A/F where you want it anyway.
Then, take the bike out and put it in fifth gear at about 25 MPH and flip the switch to "ON". Then hammer down and leave it there until about 110 MPH or about 10 seconds. Flip the switch to off and then go back to the house, plug in your laptop, and you can see right in front of your face what the A/F ratio was during the entire run. Again, adjust the Power Commander accordingly. Isn't this fun? You can see the progress you are making and in turn the bike keeps running better and better.

Note: trying to log your A/F ratio while shifting gears is more difficult to read your readings on the Wideband Commander run. As noted above, put the bike in one gear, any gear, to get about a full 10 second run. I use fifth gear but some may use fourth if you like. It doesn't matter as long as you have a full throttle 10 second run to look at on your laptop. When I was doing this on my turbo Hayabusa, holding it open in any gear for 10 seconds was very difficult and downright scary.

Any questions I will be happy to answer, in a "Jerky" way of course.

Dale "Jerk" McClure

Is namecalling OK within the rules of this messageboard?
I think the "Jerk" response is pretty good - better than the little-"j" "jerk" response :) A mildly amusing, yet high quality and informative post. Near perfect.
 
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