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Discussion Starter #1
Hello all.

I think I am about to take the plunge.

I love this marque, and her history. I am about ready to buy.

After years of owning great, but still less "passionate" motorcycles, I think I am ready to finally buy an F4. I am sick of seeing "me" riding by every week.

I don't need to wax why I am interested in an F4...we all know what makes these motorcycles so special.

I have some questions:

1) Am I to understand that every time I adjust my chain, I have to have the bike aligned?

2) Is the cooling issue solved? Is the sidestand angle solved? Is the rear tailsection subframe issue solved? The cylinder #3 failure? The rear wheel hub bearing? Is the heat-shielding staying on the motorcycle now? Any outstanding weak points on the 2012+ F4 bikes?

3) I am interested in working on this motorcycle myself...does MV make it impossible for the shade-tree mechanic?

4) Does MV stand behind their product?--I called the U.S. distributor, who was nice, but seemed very uninterested in answering any questions.

5) What is ownership like? Will this motorcycle be in the shop every month getting "corrected/tuned"? Please be honest.

I'm not expecting a Honda, but I don't want to wait on my dealer to finish scratching his head. My closest dealer is Moto Ducati/MV Agusta in Austin, Texas.

6) How is the fit and finish? How does these motorcycles "age"? Are they like BMW automobiles, falling apart after a few years? I plan on splurging on an F4 and keeping it for a decade or more---mostly for street riding and the odd track day.

7) My main concern is that I don't want to spend $23k on a motorcycle and spend no time riding it.

I have been reading the forums for the past couple of months now, and I am grateful for any additional insights any F4 owners can provide.

I thank you all for your time and help.

I hope to be prepared when I buy my F4.
 

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1) No
2) I can not speak on the new bikes
3) No
4) Yes
5) I have only had my bike in the shop 1 time and that was for the valves adjustment. Everything else I have fixed. Some of them were caused me during other projects.
6) They hold up great. Fit and finish was better on the pre2010 models.
7) You will not regret it.
 

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Hi buddy, get a new one and make sure it is right before you take her home. You'll spend half your time looking at your new baby, and the remainder of your time thinking if you want to age her by riding. Then you'll be overcome with wanting to experience her, and actually go for a ride. Then your hooked, and you will go to any length to be able to ride her and maintain her. At that point you will know that it is all worth it. Just do it! IMO
I can't speak for my MV, too new, but have every expectation that it will last just like my Duc, which have given me 0 issues since new. Maintenance is key, however. You have to be able to check the small bits and have to be careful as with operating any mechanical device, its up to you how far she'll go :)
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Thank you both, very much for your comments!

How does MV, in your experience stand by its products? Does it honor its warranty?

Specific examples, please?

Does anyone else have any thoughts relating to ownership/living with an F4? The care and feeding of the F4? The strengths and weaknesses of the F4?

Any thoughts are greatly appreciated!

Thank you all again!
 

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Thank you both, very much for your comments!

How does MV, in your experience stand by its products? Does it honor its warranty?

Specific examples, please?

Does anyone else have any thoughts relating to ownership/living with an F4? The care and feeding of the F4? The strengths and weaknesses of the F4?

Any thoughts are greatly appreciated!

Thank you all again!
Right. A specific example would be me. I am not saying that this is typical behaviour, but my experience on MV warranty so far is this:
No.

I bought a -12 F4R from Italy last spring. March actually.
It was a demo bike with 1700 kms. I used this some days. Come April 27th -13, the engine breaks down at 2840 kms. So, I called a dealer. He just said it is imported, so I will not touch it. So far it was my decision to import the bike. I can not blame MV for a dealers thinking.

However, I found a dealer/workshop, willing to do the work, provided I fill in what MV does not pay. No problem I thought. That was in August -13.

Today the following situation exists: MV has for the fourth time asked for the documentation to be sent to them, including my papers on the bike and the pictures of internal damage to the engine. It is in need of a new engine..too much internal damage.
Authorized MV dealer says it should be warranty. MV importer says it is warranty. MV says in a mail that it is warranty, and it should not be a problem.
Now, MV does not reply to my e-mails anymore.
Dealer and Importer says MV has to give a go-ahead, but they do not get any answers either.

So, my experience of MV warranty is: No. This goes for Europe. Hopefully US warranty works better.
Yes, all my papers are in order. Yes, it has been ridden carefully. Still doing break-in..

It was nice to ride.. all the 1120 kms I managed before it broke down. 1 year ago..
 

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I am looking at 2 MVs (Brutales) and I have some of the same concerns as the OP. I have been doing a lot of reading through the forum lately and I am surprised at how many issues seem to pop up within the first 500 miles of ownership (especially with fueling/mapping). It looks like their product confirmation testing is a little weak but they are quick to respond with a countermeasure to fix the issue. Otherwise their bikes seem to hold up extremely well long term.

I guess I've been spoiled because I have a Honda that is 7 years old and has never had an issue. To me it comes down to the owner and the maintenance they do on their bike. Plus I work for a major automotive manufacturer so I understand how difficult it is to have 0% failures in the market. I look forward to seeing what some of the other responses are.
 

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I paid near full price for my baby and intend to take care of it as such. If there is a warranty issue that is tied to defect, I expect them to make right or I will take any and all legal and commercial action to ensure fair treatment. I will say however, I believe their build quality is excellent in the small amount of time that I have experienced this one. Meticulous crafting is claimed on their engine build. I am confident this bike is as reliable as my duc
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Right. A specific example would be me. I am not saying that this is typical behaviour, but my experience on MV warranty so far is this:
No.

I bought a -12 F4R from Italy last spring. March actually.
It was a demo bike with 1700 kms. I used this some days. Come April 27th -13, the engine breaks down at 2840 kms. So, I called a dealer. He just said it is imported, so I will not touch it. So far it was my decision to import the bike. I can not blame MV for a dealers thinking.

However, I found a dealer/workshop, willing to do the work, provided I fill in what MV does not pay. No problem I thought. That was in August -13.

Today the following situation exists: MV has for the fourth time asked for the documentation to be sent to them, including my papers on the bike and the pictures of internal damage to the engine. It is in need of a new engine..too much internal damage.
Authorized MV dealer says it should be warranty. MV importer says it is warranty. MV says in a mail that it is warranty, and it should not be a problem.
Now, MV does not reply to my e-mails anymore.
Dealer and Importer says MV has to give a go-ahead, but they do not get any answers either.

So, my experience of MV warranty is: No. This goes for Europe. Hopefully US warranty works better.
Yes, all my papers are in order. Yes, it has been ridden carefully. Still doing break-in..

It was nice to ride.. all the 1120 kms I managed before it broke down. 1 year ago..
Wow...that is terrible! I know the taxes are murder on anything nice in Sweden...A shame.

I paid near full price for my baby and intend to take care of it as such. If there is a warranty issue that is tied to defect, I expect them to make right or I will take any and all legal and commercial action to ensure fair treatment. I will say however, I believe their build quality is excellent in the small amount of time that I have experienced this one. Meticulous crafting is claimed on their engine build. I am confident this bike is as reliable as my duc
I feel the same way.

If I buy an MV (or any make) and it falls apart, or they don't honor their warranty, I will spend thousands of dollars just to spite them.

I hope MV are not cavalier with their clients...
 

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All I can say if your heart is not in it, then move on to another brand. You can listen to the 2% which have had problem and cry all the time or be the 98% that love their bike. Go to any bike forum and you will find issues with the bikes. I am currently dealing with a leak issue on my Ducati again. I have never had that issue on my F4.
 

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I have a number of Italian bikes, including MVs. And I have JapCrap, Milwaukee products, and others. The MVs have been absolutely reliable, and are possibly the easiest to work on of any brand.

The few Gen1 issues are well-known and easily remedied. Parts supply and timeliness can be an issue. Dealers are fewer and farther between than with many other manufacturers. Warranty claims are no different than with other manufacturers overall.

I've had no major problem with any bike, including MVs. I see no reason for concern beyond the considerations above regarding parts and quantity of dealers. Most remaining dealers are primarily the better ones, in my experience.

I won't ever hesitate to buy MVs.
 

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A warranty on a new vehicle is not just a manufacturer's pledge, but a legal requirement. Providing you don't do anything to jeopardise their legal obligation to fix any defects within the warranty period, you shouldn't have any problems. In my experience MV are no different to any other manufacturer in that regard.

Si
 

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Thank you both, very much for your comments!

How does MV, in your experience stand by its products? Does it honor its warranty?

Specific examples, please.....

Thank you all again!
Greetings!

I had the same concern as you since Italian bikes have a reputation of being more temperamental than Japanese bikes; akin to German cars vs Japanese cars.

I think honoring the warranty may have just as much to do with your local dealer, in addition to the factory. Having said that, I had a great experience with my warranty work. Here's my experience...picked up a used MY10 in 2012 from a private seller. Warranty was intact for only a few more months. Took it to the closest dealer with some real issues that I learned about from this site and some minor quibbles specific to my bike. MY10 had the rear subframe needing added bracket to reinforce support, oil weeping from the clutch cover, weak return spring on the shifter, failing heat insulation inside the panels, LCD dash starting to bleed and become unreadable and the expanding gas tank that affects all Italian bike here in the states (Ducati included). Now here is where it gets even better, the headlight housing (black housing around the projector but under the clear glass) had cosmetic smudge in the plastic housing (likely from the mold during manufacturing) and my rear wheel had paint fading in certain areas that I suspect may have to do with the chemicals the previous owner used. Except for the tank, EVERYTHING was fixed without any hesitation by the dealer, including replacement of the rear wheel. Both MV and the dealer took great care of me. In fact, a year later I received an unsolicited email from the dealer that asked if I still had the bike. I confirmed that I did and they asked me to send a photo of my tank so they could order the right replacement color as they now have a fix for the tank. It doesn't get better than this.


On one hand, it is discouraging to hear of all these numerous issues on a new bike but I chalk that up to being a new model that's cutting it's teeth. In the end MV took care of me so I hope this specific example helps address your question. I'll say again, I think your local dealer may have just as much with regards to your overall experience as it is MV's. I certainly wouldn't hesitate to buy another one.


Enjoy your bike and post some pics!
 

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Discussion Starter #13
All I can say if your heart is not in it, then move on to another brand. You can listen to the 2% which have had problem and cry all the time or be the 98% that love their bike. Go to any bike forum and you will find issues with the bikes. I am currently dealing with a leak issue on my Ducati again. I have never had that issue on my F4.
My heart is in it, or I would not be here.

No need to be defensive. I have not insulted MV or its products. I am just soliciting the opinions and experiences of those who have actually owned/currently own an F4.

For me, a $20k+ bike is a lot of money, so I want to do some legwork first.

I have a number of Italian bikes, including MVs. And I have JapCrap, Milwaukee products, and others. The MVs have been absolutely reliable, and are possibly the easiest to work on of any brand.

The few Gen1 issues are well-known and easily remedied. Parts supply and timeliness can be an issue. Dealers are fewer and farther between than with many other manufacturers. Warranty claims are no different than with other manufacturers overall.

I've had no major problem with any bike, including MVs. I see no reason for concern beyond the considerations above regarding parts and quantity of dealers. Most remaining dealers are primarily the better ones, in my experience.

I won't ever hesitate to buy MVs.
Thank you!

A warranty on a new vehicle is not just a manufacturer's pledge, but a legal requirement. Providing you don't do anything to jeopardise their legal obligation to fix any defects within the warranty period, you shouldn't have any problems. In my experience MV are no different to any other manufacturer in that regard.

Si
Yes...which is why I will use my warranty to the full if I buy an F4, or any bike, for that matter. My Kawasaki is going back to the dealer for the 5th time...and it is 1 1/2 years old with under 3,000 miles. Inexcusable.

Greetings!

I had the same concern as you since Italian bikes have a reputation of being more temperamental than Japanese bikes; akin to German cars vs Japanese cars.

I think honoring the warranty may have just as much to do with your local dealer, in addition to the factory. Having said that, I had a great experience with my warranty work. Here's my experience...picked up a used MY10 in 2012 from a private seller. Warranty was intact for only a few more months. Took it to the closest dealer with some real issues that I learned about from this site and some minor quibbles specific to my bike. MY10 had the rear subframe needing added bracket to reinforce support, oil weeping from the clutch cover, weak return spring on the shifter, failing heat insulation inside the panels, LCD dash starting to bleed and become unreadable and the expanding gas tank that affects all Italian bike here in the states (Ducati included). Now here is where it gets even better, the headlight housing (black housing around the projector but under the clear glass) had cosmetic smudge in the plastic housing (likely from the mold during manufacturing) and my rear wheel had paint fading in certain areas that I suspect may have to do with the chemicals the previous owner used. Except for the tank, EVERYTHING was fixed without any hesitation by the dealer, including replacement of the rear wheel. Both MV and the dealer took great care of me. In fact, a year later I received an unsolicited email from the dealer that asked if I still had the bike. I confirmed that I did and they asked me to send a photo of my tank so they could order the right replacement color as they now have a fix for the tank. It doesn't get better than this.


On one hand, it is discouraging to hear of all these numerous issues on a new bike but I chalk that up to being a new model that's cutting it's teeth. In the end MV took care of me so I hope this specific example helps address your question. I'll say again, I think your local dealer may have just as much with regards to your overall experience as it is MV's. I certainly wouldn't hesitate to buy another one.


Enjoy your bike and post some pics!
This is highly encouraging! Thank you, friend!

Tell me more about living with an F4? What quirks (this isn't necessarily bad) does it have over a bland Japanese I-4 bike? How difficult is fairing assembly/re-assembly for when I do my own maintenance? Is it true the gearbox takes separate lubrication than the engine, like an automobile engine?

Are the MV "special tools" in the manuals actually needed to keep her up-and-running?

My local dealer has not been helpful--the parts counter guy only knows Ducatis and the technicians were all too busy.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Buy the mv and enjoy it. You can't compare it to a japenese bike. Totally different.

Sent from Motorcycle.com App
I know they are different, but how so? As someone who owns and rides and F4, what is it that makes it different? That is, other than the exquisite looks, intoxicating sound, exclusivity, exotic appeal, history, etc?

What is ownership like?

What do you feel when you turn the key?

What is riding it like?

How does MV Agusta North America treat it's clients, in your experience?

How long does it take to get parts for service?

How is long-term durability/fit-and-finish?

What are the F4's strong points?/It's weak ones?

I am interested in the owner's perspective, versus Sport Rider magazine or some publication that doesn't ride the bike 15k miles over a period of years.

I have done a lot of reading, but have not found a thread that asks what is ownership like?
 

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Hello all.

I think I am about to take the plunge.

I love this marque, and her history. I am about ready to buy.

After years of owning great, but still less "passionate" motorcycles, I think I am ready to finally buy an F4. I am sick of seeing "me" riding by every week.

I don't need to wax why I am interested in an F4...we all know what makes these motorcycles so special.

I have some questions:

1) Am I to understand that every time I adjust my chain, I have to have the bike aligned?

you mean re-adjusting the ride height? 5min job, yes.

2) Is the cooling issue solved?on the >10 bikes? Yes.

Is the sidestand angle solved? Only a problem for some guys.Is the rear tailsection subframe issue solved? this was only a issue on the first few y10 modelsThe cylinder #3 failure? Conrad failure?Again, it's model specific, mostly 1000S <10 models.The rear wheel hub bearing? Another model specific question. <y10 models only, get a Mitchy hub if you're worried.Is the heat-shielding staying on the motorcycle now? Any outstanding weak points on the 2012+ F4 bikes? Still developing and perfecting tuning option.

3) I am interested in working on this motorcycle myself...does MV make it impossible for the shade-tree mechanic?
depends on how capable you are.
4) Does MV stand behind their product?--I called the U.S. distributor, who was nice, but seemed very uninterested in answering any questions.
dealers deal with issues.
5) What is ownership like? Will this motorcycle be in the shop every month getting "corrected/tuned"? Please be honest.
it often depends on owners capability and dealers competency .

I'm not expecting a Honda, but I don't want to wait on my dealer to finish scratching his head. My closest dealer is Moto Ducati/MV Agusta in Austin, Texas.

6) How is the fit and finish? How does these motorcycles "age"? Are they like BMW automobiles, falling apart after a few years? I plan on splurging on an F4 and keeping it for a decade or more---mostly for street riding and the odd track day.
You'd have to be kidding, coming from a Honda...!?
7) My main concern is that I don't want to spend $23k on a motorcycle and spend no time riding it.

I have been reading the forums for the past couple of months now, and I am grateful for any additional insights any F4 owners can provide.

I thank you all for your time and help.

I hope to be prepared when I buy my F4.
I know they are different, but how so? As someone who owns and rides and F4, what is it that makes it different? That is, other than the exquisite looks, intoxicating sound, exclusivity, exotic appeal, history, etc?

I suggest you read some more, look at the events, see the MV guys getting together. Read throughout the pictures threads.

What is ownership like? Like being married to the girl everybody wanted in school.

What do you feel when you turn the key? Unbuttoning that girls shirt.

What is riding it like? Not saying any more...

How does MV Agusta North America treat it's clients, in your experience?

How long does it take to get parts for service?

How is long-term durability/fit-and-finish?
You've asked this before, go to a shop and see for yourself.
What are the F4's strong points?/It's weak ones?
everybody will have his own opinion based on life experience and riding skill.

I am interested in the owner's perspective, versus Sport Rider magazine or some publication that doesn't ride the bike 15k miles over a period of years.

I have done a lot of reading, but have not found a thread that asks what is ownership like?
Maybe you read in the wrong places, or you can't see what's right in front of you.
Go get one, or you will never know.

Hope this helps.
 

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These aren't '80s Jaguars or Yugos, etc. They're reliable. There are a handful of specific issues with certain models that are easily remedied. There are small manufacturer occasions of parts availability and dealer scarcity for inconveniences.

They have soul and personality, great performance, and are rewarding to own and wrench on yourself with uncommon ease. This forum has the best technical assistance anywhere, like Donsy and the rest.

In a back-handed way, it's almost insulting to ask such volumes of questions that wouldn't be queried of JapCrap brands and other Euro marques.

I have large collections of a cross-section of brands. You have no extraordinary need for concern. If anything, this is the most solvent and stable period in MV's modern history. Go ride one (or more). If it talks to you, listen. If not, I don't know what to tell you.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
These aren't '80s Jaguars or Yugos, etc. They're reliable. There are a handful of specific issues with certain models that are easily remedied. There are small manufacturer occasions of parts availability and dealer scarcity for inconveniences.

They have soul and personality, great performance, and are rewarding to own and wrench on yourself with uncommon ease. This forum has the best technical assistance anywhere, like Donsy and the rest.

In a back-handed way, it's almost insulting to ask such volumes of questions that wouldn't be queried of JapCrap brands and other Euro marques.

I have large collections of a cross-section of brands. You have no extraordinary need for concern. If anything, this is the most solvent and stable period in MV's modern history. Go ride one (or more). If it talks to you, listen. If not, I don't know what to tell you.
I ask these questions not to be back-handed, but because I have not owned, nor have I met anyone who has owned an MV.

How can I assume anything? I don't assume my Kawasaki is reliable--it has been to the dealer 6 times for recalls and warranty issues and it is only 1 1/2 years and 2,800 miles old.

This is inexcusable.
 

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I ask these questions not to be back-handed, but because I have not owned, nor have I met anyone who has owned an MV.

How can I assume anything? I don't assume my Kawasaki is reliable--it has been to the dealer 6 times for recalls and warranty issues and it is only 1 1/2 years and 2,800 miles old.

This is inexcusable.
MV Agusta ownership will likely be much more pleasant than your current Kawasaki experience. But I've owned, and still own, a boatload of Kawasakis; and I'd say that's a very abnormal situation for your Kwacka.

The hallmark of the F4 is its handling stability. It loves to be on its side, and it stays where you put it with great feedback. I much prefer the Gen1 bikes, even though the Gen2s are arguably "better" all-around motorcycles. It's like the difference between vinyl and digital audio media.

I don't even know which MV you're considering, presumably the Gen2 F4 based on your OP quote of $23K for the purchase price.

The Gen2s don't have the overheating issue or the hub issue. They've had the well-publicized fuel-mapping consumer Beta-test, because it wasn't sorted pre-production. That's virtually behind us now, and with more and more refinement to come.

There are scattered individual issues, but all are similar to the Big-4 Jappers and other Euro manufacturers. Remember that both Aprilia and BMW had extensive recalls for connecting rod bolt problems. Kawasaki had a similar significant engine issue with the latest ZX-10R generation. All have been resolved, though at great inconvenience to owners (and dealers, truth be told).

I probably appreciate as great a cross-section of brands and types and niches and eras of motorcycles as anyone drawing breath. MVs are incomparable in intangible ways. And that's one of the reasons many aren't giving the more tangible feedback you're wanting in such minutiae.

MVs are engaging and emotion-evoking. It's an experience, and that doesn't always translate into words. I don't know if you've ever driven many Ferraris and Lamborghinis, but that experience would translate if you have.

The Gen2 F4s don't have quite the feeling of low-production hand-built quality of the Gen1 F4s, but they're still levels above all other competitors in fit and finish. It's not a Honda competence and appliance type of fit and finish. It's an exquisite and artfully substantial type of fit and finish, with a quality that belies mere function. It's sensory before and beyond the riding experience itself. Many owners spend time in the garage with their bikes to look at them and even talk to them. I have, and do.

From the purely practical side regarding dependability, MVs are as reliable as anything on a general basis. The problems you see on this forum are not a percentage indication of failure and mechanical woes. The niche size of MV Agusta has just not provided enough dealers to do all the trouble-shooting, etc.

Tamburini-era MVs are certainly far beyond Tamburini-era Ducatis in reliability and servicability, as well as cost of ownership. The newer-eras of Ducatis have progressively improved in all those areas. Overall, MVs offer the same level of mechanical dependability as any other brand. The dealer insufficiencies can sometimes be a bottleneck.

But it's not a crap-shoot. MV Agusta stands behind their products. And I'd never hesitate for one second to buy any product they offer if it's what I want to have in my garage.

An argument could be made that in case of any down-time, MVs may not be the best candidates for an only-bike garage. But I'm not sure I would even agree with that. (Though I can't imagine having a one-bike garage, so I'm probably not the one to reference for such a perception or preference.)

Go test ride one. If you don't have a conversation with her, you may not be ready for such a mistress. MVs are usually bought with the heart, not the head.

As always, your mileage may vary about any/all of this.:yo:
 
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