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post #7511 of 8354 (permalink) Old 04-07-2019, 01:37 AM
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Originally Posted by cccpNyC View Post
The shooting sucks. It truly does. But bad shit happens. It boggles my mind we demonize guns, when there are more people killed by drunk and distracted drivers every year.


A quick google search showed over 10k due to alcohol impairment in 2016.
The same year, around the same number of murders with firearms. And I bet you when you remove the number of gang related deaths out of the equation, we are looking at a much smaller number.


I have yet to see anyone promote the banning of cars or alcohol.

We haven't even gotten into the distracted drivers to pile onto the auto death number.

Are we banning cell phones?


And you know what? I'll take freedom with some inherent risks over a false sense of security and "safety" any day.

Even if it ultimately results in my untimely demise.
Freedom is scary.

Criminals give 2 flying fucks about rules. If you for a minute think that banning guns will eliminate the possibility of a bad person using guns to carry out some evil shit, you are living in a dream world. Even if they don't, whats to stop them from renting a box truck and...oh wait they did that too. Ban all the box trucks!!! Ban planes while your at it too I guess.
For the life of me, why do people link car deaths with gun deaths. its bloody pointless. One is for transport, one is for target practice, and for killing. You can't carry a fucking car into a Mosque and kill 50 people. I get that in the US you have a gun culture, and people idolise the gun, and to some its a fanaticism and a fetish. Anything can be construed as a weapon, but these right wing supremacists chose the the AR15 and the like because they can commit mass murder easily. They are sick mental fucks that have unhealthy fetishes to guns.
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post #7512 of 8354 (permalink) Old 04-07-2019, 02:07 AM
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For the life of me, why do people link car deaths with gun deaths. its bloody pointless. One is for transport, one is for target practice, and for killing. You can't carry a fucking car into a Mosque and kill 50 people. I get that in the US you have a gun culture, and people idolise the gun, and to some its a fanaticism and a fetish. Anything can be construed as a weapon, but these right wing supremacists chose the the AR15 and the like because they can commit mass murder easily. They are sick mental fucks that have unhealthy fetishes to guns.



They are both inanimate objects. We need to stop blaming inanimate objects for EVIL PEOPLE.


You say "you can't carry a car into a Mosque and kill 50 ppl"



The victims of Nice, France would say otherwise. 86 people died. With a truck. That evil POS didn't need a gun to commit a mass atrocity.



And you say cars are for transport? Correct. Until some POS decides to drink or text and suddenly, POOF!. They are now in control of a several thousand pound battering ram capable of inflicting damage to innocent people. May it only be 1 or 2 or 5 victims? Sure. But the frequency in which it happens yields the results I outlined above in my 1st post. Should we be any less enraged at these senseless deaths, regardless to the dispersed nature as opposed to one concentrated publicized incident? Do you support measures to ban cars? We should just all use buses. If it saves 1 life right? Or just ban alcohol. Its fer da chilrens.


People, not inanimate objects, kill people.



And what about instances where an AR15 or AK variant helped a law abiding citizen repel shitbirds and protected their God given right to self preservation.


Church shooting in Sutherland Spring, TX, stopped by a good guy with an AR


Family in my own town of Las Vegas, used an AK47 to prevent 2 would be robbers who forced their way into the home.


I could go on. But it only solidifies my point.. inanimate objects hold no more good or evil than the person wielding them, be it a car or a bottle of hootch or a gun.


I own quite a few guns. Even own a bumpstock. I am very right wing. Does that make me an unstable mental fuck?
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post #7513 of 8354 (permalink) Old 04-07-2019, 02:56 AM
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^^^ How many cars do you see on a battle field, none, they (army) carry weapons that can inflict the most carnage as possible, the same weapons are available to Joe Blogs in the public. Sane today, insane tomorrow. The mental balance between sanity and insanity is a fine line. Mental illness can strike at anytime, and it afflicts left and right leaning people. Theres some pretty bad drugs out there causing psychosis and mental disorders. I don't care that guns are easy to obtain in the US, even military style weapons, thats for your country to sort out, but your NRA funded Trump to the tune of 30 million to get elected, and they thought they could help fight against the new gun laws here, but they can fuck off, we don't want your armed at all costs mentality in our country. i just don't want them available in my country, and more than 80% of the population don't want them here. And now we have a government thats got the balls to rid our country of them. It has now been passed through parliament with i believe 99% voter support, 1% 1 person didn't turn up for the vote, then did a whinge about it, you guessed it, our one and only extreme right winger didn't even bother to turn up and vote, gutless cunt didn't want the opposing vote on his conscience.
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post #7514 of 8354 (permalink) Old 04-07-2019, 03:11 PM
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post #7515 of 8354 (permalink) Old 04-07-2019, 06:12 PM
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Nope .. Because a "Settlement out of court was done" -- probably the case against Smollet was seen as too weak to be absolutely sure of conviction on at least most of the charges .. So the lawyers get together and arranged a "settlement" - Which is then kept under wraps -- No one risks loosing face -- Justice done? Who knows?
1st we have an actor whose role is being written out of the show......motive
He files a false police report
They have the cancelled check he paid the Nigerians with
They have the security camera video of the Nigerians buying the rope
The FBI was involved since January, false hate crime and felony mail fraud
The independent Grand Jury charges him with 16 felonies
The State's Attorney for Cook County Kim Foxx drops all charges....
The Mayor Rahm Emanuel and the Police Superintendent Eddie Johnson are furious

Kim Fox's PAC (political action committee) gets a donation of $408,000
Case is sealed

It is Chicago after all......but this reeks of corruption
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post #7516 of 8354 (permalink) Old 04-07-2019, 07:05 PM
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Reason has left the building .. Again ...

@DaveNZ:


Do you really think banning "Military style semiautomatic rifles" will prevent another atrocity in NZ??? Yes! .. It MAY prevent some looney using the same METHOD (Unless he/she has connections that can procure an illegal firearm .. which a journalist recently proved possible even in a country like England, where semiautomatic rifles have been banned since the late 1980ies)
Someone as committed to setting up and using an atrocity like the Breivik killings or this one in NZ will find a way. To me it looks very much like Tarrant started planning this "horror show" years ago, while still living in Australia .. There he could not easily get hold of the particular style of weapon he wanted (I have no doubt that there was nothing accidental about his choice of weapon .. it had to be "The black rifle" - The AR-15 style seen in the hands of the "Hero" in every action movie for the last 3 decades, this coice was part of the "show" he clearly staged and put up on social media)

I'm sure he fancied himself a great "close combat gunfighter" - He might even have been deluded enough to think of himself as "killing terrorists" like in a game of Counterstrike .. Again the gun was chosen specifically, not for its efficiency, there are semi-auto hunting rifles that pack way more "power" than the 223 AR "mousegun" A Browning BAR with a magazine extension comes to mind .. 308Win or 300WinMag -- Will they be banned .. They are not "military style" --



And yes, no need to hide it, I LIKE guns .. They are the best tools for war and getting food.. Thats just the way things are. I live in a country where getting a gun legally is very difficult, there are police background checks, to get a hunting rifle of any kind you need to pass a test, to obtain a hunting license, then a safety and shooting proficiency test to be allowed to even apply for a police permit for a rifle. You have to pay about $150 every year to keep the hunting permit, and $200+ for every rifle you want to buy. Fail to pay the yearly fee for the hunting permit = you loose the right to "keep and bear" the rifle(s) since you are no longer allowed to hunt. Thgere are NO exceptions, not even for the guys in the armed forces, who carry fully automatic weapons every day or for a policeman who carries his sidearm every day at work.. Some time ago I sold one of my weapons to a guy from one of the "special Forces" -- I was not allowed to hand that weapon over to him, unless he could produce a police permit for the specific weapon. In my country you will no longer get a permit for an AR-15 or any of the "clones" -- There are very few of those on civilian hands here.

So you say .. An attack with such a weapon could not happen here? Well Guess again -- It did -- more than once, none of the guns involved were civilian owned -- They were stolen from the armed forces or "imported" from Eastern Europe --

So, in effect such a ban is "A show to make "joe public" FEEL safer -- and make the politiciens LOOK like they are "cracking down hard on unwanted guns" -- It's all a populistic "show" -- Very "1984" style -- along with all the left-wingers (and rightwingers) that always shouts: "Why do you have a problem with more Cameras keeping our streets "safer" -- If you have nothing to hide, then why do you oppose the things that make people "feel safer" --


On the other hand: To all of you in "The land of the free": I my view, too many of you suffer under the illusion, brought on,no doubt, by 100+ years of mainstream entertainment, constantly portraying the "Gun in the hand of the righteous" as a good and acceptable solution to almost ANY kind of problem..

Yes, in very specific,and very limited circumstances, the "good guy" wielding a gun MAY solve more problems than he causes, but you will have to acknowledge the fact that people from other areas of the world does NOT share this view! They (A majority of western Europeans) have NO other positive experience with guns, than what they have seen on fictional entertainment imagery -- My parents (and I'm nearing 60 ..yikes) are the last generation to have any memory of Armed conflict .. And that memory is NOT a good one .. The bad guys back then were REALLY BAD .. They did not indiscriminately kill a few "socialists" or a few "religious people" They very discriminately butchered whole nations ... And those guys are still making the very best weapons ... Food for thought.. ehh?


In Germany "military style semiautomatic weapons" have been available for 50+ years to civilians (with all the appropriate paperwork of course!!) -- Germany has 57 million citizens, and one of the highest percentages of muslims (And right wing extremists) in Europe -- And yet... Not one single "AR-15 shooting atrocity" -- Only one single "School shooting" (which was not done with a "military style semiautomatic rifle") -- Now -- Why is that? probably not because "ze germans" are less prone to insanity then other nations. Back in the 70ies and 80ies they did have som "bad guys" -- The "RAF" or "Rote Armee Fraktion" - real fanatics on the ultra left wing.
Did that make "ze germans" do "knee-jerk" gun bans? -- No - Because "ze Germans" base their government decisions in facts, measurements and valid statistics, not in "feelings" and "sentiment" or "public opinion" -- A lot of countries/nations could learn from that, including my own ..



Rant over ...

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post #7517 of 8354 (permalink) Old 04-07-2019, 08:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DKDravis View Post
@DaveNZ:


Do you really think banning "Military style semiautomatic rifles" will prevent another atrocity in NZ??? Yes! .. It MAY prevent some looney using the same METHOD (Unless he/she has connections that can procure an illegal firearm .. which a journalist recently proved possible even in a country like England, where semiautomatic rifles have been banned since the late 1980ies)
Someone as committed to setting up and using an atrocity like the Breivik killings or this one in NZ will find a way. To me it looks very much like Tarrant started planning this "horror show" years ago, while still living in Australia .. There he could not easily get hold of the particular style of weapon he wanted (I have no doubt that there was nothing accidental about his choice of weapon .. it had to be "The black rifle" - The AR-15 style seen in the hands of the "Hero" in every action movie for the last 3 decades, this coice was part of the "show" he clearly staged and put up on social media)

I'm sure he fancied himself a great "close combat gunfighter" - He might even have been deluded enough to think of himself as "killing terrorists" like in a game of Counterstrike .. Again the gun was chosen specifically, not for its efficiency, there are semi-auto hunting rifles that pack way more "power" than the 223 AR "mousegun" A Browning BAR with a magazine extension comes to mind .. 308Win or 300WinMag -- Will they be banned .. They are not "military style" --



And yes, no need to hide it, I LIKE guns .. They are the best tools for war and getting food.. Thats just the way things are. I live in a country where getting a gun legally is very difficult, there are police background checks, to get a hunting rifle of any kind you need to pass a test, to obtain a hunting license, then a safety and shooting proficiency test to be allowed to even apply for a police permit for a rifle. You have to pay about $150 every year to keep the hunting permit, and $200+ for every rifle you want to buy. Fail to pay the yearly fee for the hunting permit = you loose the right to "keep and bear" the rifle(s) since you are no longer allowed to hunt. Thgere are NO exceptions, not even for the guys in the armed forces, who carry fully automatic weapons every day or for a policeman who carries his sidearm every day at work.. Some time ago I sold one of my weapons to a guy from one of the "special Forces" -- I was not allowed to hand that weapon over to him, unless he could produce a police permit for the specific weapon. In my country you will no longer get a permit for an AR-15 or any of the "clones" -- There are very few of those on civilian hands here.

So you say .. An attack with such a weapon could not happen here? Well Guess again -- It did -- more than once, none of the guns involved were civilian owned -- They were stolen from the armed forces or "imported" from Eastern Europe --

So, in effect such a ban is "A show to make "joe public" FEEL safer -- and make the politiciens LOOK like they are "cracking down hard on unwanted guns" -- It's all a populistic "show" -- Very "1984" style -- along with all the left-wingers (and rightwingers) that always shouts: "Why do you have a problem with more Cameras keeping our streets "safer" -- If you have nothing to hide, then why do you oppose the things that make people "feel safer" --


On the other hand: To all of you in "The land of the free": I my view, too many of you suffer under the illusion, brought on,no doubt, by 100+ years of mainstream entertainment, constantly portraying the "Gun in the hand of the righteous" as a good and acceptable solution to almost ANY kind of problem..

Yes, in very specific,and very limited circumstances, the "good guy" wielding a gun MAY solve more problems than he causes, but you will have to acknowledge the fact that people from other areas of the world does NOT share this view! They (A majority of western Europeans) have NO other positive experience with guns, than what they have seen on fictional entertainment imagery -- My parents (and I'm nearing 60 ..yikes) are the last generation to have any memory of Armed conflict .. And that memory is NOT a good one .. The bad guys back then were REALLY BAD .. They did not indiscriminately kill a few "socialists" or a few "religious people" They very discriminately butchered whole nations ... And those guys are still making the very best weapons ... Food for thought.. ehh?


In Germany "military style semiautomatic weapons" have been available for 50+ years to civilians (with all the appropriate paperwork of course!!) -- Germany has 57 million citizens, and one of the highest percentages of muslims (And right wing extremists) in Europe -- And yet... Not one single "AR-15 shooting atrocity" -- Only one single "School shooting" (which was not done with a "military style semiautomatic rifle") -- Now -- Why is that? probably not because "ze germans" are less prone to insanity then other nations. Back in the 70ies and 80ies they did have som "bad guys" -- The "RAF" or "Rote Armee Fraktion" - real fanatics on the ultra left wing.
Did that make "ze germans" do "knee-jerk" gun bans? -- No - Because "ze Germans" base their government decisions in facts, measurements and valid statistics, not in "feelings" and "sentiment" or "public opinion" -- A lot of countries/nations could learn from that, including my own ..



Rant over ...
Very informative. Thank you for sharing.

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post #7518 of 8354 (permalink) Old 04-07-2019, 09:02 PM
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Currently looking actually, but had ankle surgery so not only did that cost a lot.... I can't ride right now. And yes Tennessee has some spectacular roads, I have easily 100's of miles of roads that are curvy and fun within 20 miles of my house and I live in the city. Tennessee is great, it's growing pretty fast but still has a lot of character. Food is good, if you like bourbon and whiskey its all over the place. The public schools in suburbs of Nashville are really good. If you like outdoors we have it all except snow
I noticed a typo on my part, I meant to say that from what I have heard about Tenessee, that a turismo veloce would seem a good choice for your mix of road types.
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post #7519 of 8354 (permalink) Old 04-07-2019, 11:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DKDravis View Post
@DaveNZ:


Do you really think banning "Military style semiautomatic rifles" will prevent another atrocity in NZ??? Yes! .. It MAY prevent some looney using the same METHOD (Unless he/she has connections that can procure an illegal firearm .. which a journalist recently proved possible even in a country like England, where semiautomatic rifles have been banned since the late 1980ies)
Someone as committed to setting up and using an atrocity like the Breivik killings or this one in NZ will find a way. To me it looks very much like Tarrant started planning this "horror show" years ago, while still living in Australia .. There he could not easily get hold of the particular style of weapon he wanted (I have no doubt that there was nothing accidental about his choice of weapon .. it had to be "The black rifle" - The AR-15 style seen in the hands of the "Hero" in every action movie for the last 3 decades, this coice was part of the "show" he clearly staged and put up on social media)

I'm sure he fancied himself a great "close combat gunfighter" - He might even have been deluded enough to think of himself as "killing terrorists" like in a game of Counterstrike .. Again the gun was chosen specifically, not for its efficiency, there are semi-auto hunting rifles that pack way more "power" than the 223 AR "mousegun" A Browning BAR with a magazine extension comes to mind .. 308Win or 300WinMag -- Will they be banned .. They are not "military style" --



And yes, no need to hide it, I LIKE guns .. They are the best tools for war and getting food.. Thats just the way things are. I live in a country where getting a gun legally is very difficult, there are police background checks, to get a hunting rifle of any kind you need to pass a test, to obtain a hunting license, then a safety and shooting proficiency test to be allowed to even apply for a police permit for a rifle. You have to pay about $150 every year to keep the hunting permit, and $200+ for every rifle you want to buy. Fail to pay the yearly fee for the hunting permit = you loose the right to "keep and bear" the rifle(s) since you are no longer allowed to hunt. Thgere are NO exceptions, not even for the guys in the armed forces, who carry fully automatic weapons every day or for a policeman who carries his sidearm every day at work.. Some time ago I sold one of my weapons to a guy from one of the "special Forces" -- I was not allowed to hand that weapon over to him, unless he could produce a police permit for the specific weapon. In my country you will no longer get a permit for an AR-15 or any of the "clones" -- There are very few of those on civilian hands here.

So you say .. An attack with such a weapon could not happen here? Well Guess again -- It did -- more than once, none of the guns involved were civilian owned -- They were stolen from the armed forces or "imported" from Eastern Europe --

So, in effect such a ban is "A show to make "joe public" FEEL safer -- and make the politiciens LOOK like they are "cracking down hard on unwanted guns" -- It's all a populistic "show" -- Very "1984" style -- along with all the left-wingers (and rightwingers) that always shouts: "Why do you have a problem with more Cameras keeping our streets "safer" -- If you have nothing to hide, then why do you oppose the things that make people "feel safer" --


On the other hand: To all of you in "The land of the free": I my view, too many of you suffer under the illusion, brought on,no doubt, by 100+ years of mainstream entertainment, constantly portraying the "Gun in the hand of the righteous" as a good and acceptable solution to almost ANY kind of problem..

Yes, in very specific,and very limited circumstances, the "good guy" wielding a gun MAY solve more problems than he causes, but you will have to acknowledge the fact that people from other areas of the world does NOT share this view! They (A majority of western Europeans) have NO other positive experience with guns, than what they have seen on fictional entertainment imagery -- My parents (and I'm nearing 60 ..yikes) are the last generation to have any memory of Armed conflict .. And that memory is NOT a good one .. The bad guys back then were REALLY BAD .. They did not indiscriminately kill a few "socialists" or a few "religious people" They very discriminately butchered whole nations ... And those guys are still making the very best weapons ... Food for thought.. ehh?


In Germany "military style semiautomatic weapons" have been available for 50+ years to civilians (with all the appropriate paperwork of course!!) -- Germany has 57 million citizens, and one of the highest percentages of muslims (And right wing extremists) in Europe -- And yet... Not one single "AR-15 shooting atrocity" -- Only one single "School shooting" (which was not done with a "military style semiautomatic rifle") -- Now -- Why is that? probably not because "ze germans" are less prone to insanity then other nations. Back in the 70ies and 80ies they did have som "bad guys" -- The "RAF" or "Rote Armee Fraktion" - real fanatics on the ultra left wing.
Did that make "ze germans" do "knee-jerk" gun bans? -- No - Because "ze Germans" base their government decisions in facts, measurements and valid statistics, not in "feelings" and "sentiment" or "public opinion" -- A lot of countries/nations could learn from that, including my own ..



Rant over ...
Banning these rapid fire military style guns in Australia managed to stop the mass murders happening there, and if these guns were never aloud here, this supremacist wouldn't have chosen NZ to commit his mass murder, he may have gone to the US. Any way legislation has been passed to ban these guns, one massacre too late, but its now done. If your not in the army or the police force then theres no need for these guns.
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post #7520 of 8354 (permalink) Old 04-08-2019, 01:18 AM
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Indeed, Dave. Trying to link deaths from one area to deaths in another (eg guns and cars) is a trick the tobacco industry pulled to ensure profit reigned over health. It is then wrapped up as 'freedom of choice', and of course if you add the word liberty, yanks will fall for it everytime.

It really is just basic common sense. Laws, made by the people you elect, to ensure that everyone gets a fair go, including those who do not believe that there is such a thing as a 'god given right' to do anything. 2nd amendment goodledygook. The NRA & US Govt will have no credibility until they call for a plebiscite on gun laws. Or even better, the US gets a new govt. Tick tick.

Interesting that the Germans need no such laws, perhaps it is very well resourced and compotent policing? Perhaps they have had enough of guns.

Although Australia is just a suburb of the USA, I had not heard that Smollet got off. That is probably as a result of the dubious & seemingly incompotent justice system in the US and whatever state Smoll lived in; maybe he was deemed to have a mental illness; and money, as there is always money involved. Gangsters and bullies. Or there is always the possibilty that the 'crimes' he committed where not punishable by a gaol sentence.
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