Our new generation is begging for... Discord! - MVAgusta.net
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post #1 of 17 (permalink) Old 05-18-2019, 03:32 AM Thread Starter
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Our new generation is begging for... Discord!

Discord chat? How does everyone feel about that? I am a part of two technical communities, Grav CMS development and macOS on AMD, and they're pretty vibrant and helpful, attract new people in all the right ways, there's search and there are bots which anyone can easily invoke for newbie questions, user groups, etc. That may seem like a drastic move for mvagusta.net but why not try? It's not the old IRC chat of old, no stale air to it and folks seem to dig it really well. Seems like a great way to move forward into the future as forums are getting more and more obsolete by the day and we must get on with the program but make sure we don't lose the best parts.

Inspired by light reading of "I am done" thread which I have just discovered.

Thoughts?
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post #2 of 17 (permalink) Old 05-18-2019, 06:47 AM
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. . . Seems like a great way to move forward into the future as forums are getting more and more obsolete by the day . . .
Thoughts?
Hiya Buck.

Any stats on that?

As owner of a few different bikes, I make contributions to a few forums. Sure, some are stale with dwindling membership, but that is generally (in my view) a result of the relevant bikes becoming obsolete or out of 'fashion'.

There are some very vibrant and growing Honda and Yamaha R1 communities of which I'm closely related.

MV of course is more of a specialist rather than 'main stream' forum so there might well be a more transient membership base.

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post #3 of 17 (permalink) Old 05-18-2019, 06:56 AM
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..Dont fix what isnt broken

I'll stick to this forum.
And forums might get obsolete, but this forum is far from dead. Its one of the most alive and new members join in....basically daily.

Now I dont want to sound like the negative one.
But can you even imagine what kind of sh!tshow it will become over there at discord.

On this forum we got a main subject called: Maintenance & Tech. Issues (All 4 Cyl. Models)
And that subject houses many many different threads/topics cause every owner out there has a different issue, which can be explained and discussed into detail.

Over at discord you then need to make the subject: Maintenance & Tech. Issues (All 4 Cyl. Models)
And then a moderator creates 5-10 threads with most commonly issues that happens with these 4 cylinder bikes. (Bequase new members CANNOT create threads, only admin and moderators can)
And here is where the sh!tshow begins. With only 5-10 threads members need to choose where their issue belongs. Now take a look at this forum and how many different threads there are.....

Lets not forget everyone will have a slightly different issue(For example: Fluid issue is name of thread). Guy1 asked about a coolant leak, and Guy4 asked about a fuel leak and Guy7 has an brake fluid issue.
And these 3 different topics will be in 1 chat room and everyone will be chatting through one another.

Ofcourse, maybe I am seeing it totally wrong.
But IMHO to bring this forum layout over to discord will be a mistake.

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post #4 of 17 (permalink) Old 05-18-2019, 07:25 AM
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This shows how out of touch I am with the generational changes and new tech.

When I read the title of this thread I thought: We’ve already got enough discord in the GPR thread and elsewhere in the forum!

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post #5 of 17 (permalink) Old 05-19-2019, 03:19 AM Thread Starter
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I don't have any stats per se, just how I feel things work, having used both the forums and Discord (and IRC too) channels extensively in the last year. On Discord it's much easier to go ahead and ask silly questions for one. Here whenever I create a new topic with a problem I couldn't find in the archives by simply using the terms which weren't present in the original question, I always feel a little ashamed, given that it has a high potential of attracting "nothing new under the sun" kind of sentiments. So inside I would feel that MVAgusta.net is reserved for discussing "serious" business rather than dealing with stupid questions of "why doesn't it start". Again, this is how I psychologically feel, it doesn't mean that any of you guys are unhelpful. So take as a coming out kind of problem, if you will. Perhaps many others feel the same way, we just don't and won't hear from them.

Second issue is that for those quick kinds of questions full-on registration right from the start is unnecessary. That's how I started asking questions in Grav - I dropped a question here and there, gauged the general attitude, got familiarised with the folks around there and some time later understood that I really liked it there and wanted to register proper. Putting the burden of full responsibility and commitment on new members and expecting them to be just like everyone who's already been hanging around for years is asking for too much without obvious benefits to anyone. So in the end they (Grav) gained a member that knows what he's really after and can not only be a source of questions but also answers.

We're attracting new people who may not have joined otherwise. That is always a good thing. Kind of like a user nursery that actually works because it doesn't place any demands on one.

It's also quite dynamic, issues that feel heavy in the regular forums may get easily and quickly resolved with a funny cat meme without devolving into a long drama opera. The forums by their nature tend to have people on edge for longer than necessary when dealing with complex uneasy personal stuff. You'd have a million answers prepared already by the time that other person decides to answer. Obviously it's best to take that kind of interaction out of the main flow, and forums as a platform can't handle that. Bans and things only add layers upon layers of band aids to the problem.

The same dynamic nature also means shorter paths to solutions to anything, be it valve maintenance or community website fixing proposals. That works wonders in development, but I won't claim it's good for every project/community.

People due to their nature tend to forget that the internet is all about evolving, and it means parting with the old ways on a regular basis, not just to be relevant for relevance's sake, but to be of more use to a broader audience, to bring more joy to everyone, younger generations especially.

I'm not sure what Black_Gold_Saw means by "threads" on Discord, I've seen issues handled by bot commands. So whenever someone pops in with a quick question, instead of html-redirecting them to a FAQ or a thread, one could type "$hw valves" and have bot immediately output the answer that works in 90% cases. In case a clarification is needed, a chat ensues. After a while if a member is active and is willing to participate, Discord users can be broken into infinite amount of groups with various rights concerning managing the infos the bots provide, serving as beacons for users, doing community management, etc. Give it some time and helpful complex self-managing community eventually develops.
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post #6 of 17 (permalink) Old 05-19-2019, 04:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buck View Post
I'm not sure what Black_Gold_Saw means by "threads" on Discord, I've seen issues handled by bot commands. So whenever someone pops in with a quick question, instead of html-redirecting them to a FAQ or a thread, one could type "$hw valves" and have bot immediately output the answer that works in 90% cases. In case a clarification is needed, a chat ensues. After a while if a member is active and is willing to participate, Discord users can be broken into infinite amount of groups with various rights concerning managing the infos the bots provide, serving as beacons for users, doing community management, etc. Give it some time and helpful complex self-managing community eventually develops.
What I mean with subject & threads is shown in this picture:

Red title = Main subject.
blue title = threads/topics. <- the chat rooms to discuss an issue.

New comers cannot make threads, so admin/moderator needs to make a handfull of threads that are common issue across 4 cylinder bikes.
And since everyone has a different issue it will become a mess in a chat room.

If you want a MV discord, the only way it could work is for people to just have a chat about their bikes.
Their trips, their modifications.

But litteraly making discord the replacement for this forum isnt going to work.
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post #7 of 17 (permalink) Old 05-19-2019, 06:40 AM
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leave them alone...

Hi,
My two cents on this topic:
I'm on many forums and groups related to MV Agusta, Turismo Veloce and other brands of bike. Basically none works the way this forum works. And in some occurrences, while there is very valid contributions on some facebook groups, the search makes them useless few days after publication. Worse, people on those tend to think instant messenger and sometimes creates WhatsApp and other applications groups to complement it: the only result is that it dilutes the knowledge. People tend to ask where they can have an instant response, and it will be always the same being helpful and discord is only an additional way to dilute the knowledge at the end…

Ultimately : don't fix something which is not broken.

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post #8 of 17 (permalink) Old 05-19-2019, 10:44 AM
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i'm a forum user , and also administrator of facebook group MV Agusta France.

from my point of view it's not only a problem of generation, but internet is changing and the need of the poeple is changing also (or reverse)

for me the forum is no more the best ways to share information on internet, because it's difficult to share picture, to discuss... but it's actually the best way to keep knowledge.

facebook is the best way to share pict to discuss, but to make research on to find information and keep knowledge it's difficult.

we need an hybride tool



to resum, for new sign in it's difficult to find information on forum or facebook because the research or not the best one, sometimes they don't have the good words to make their research, and if they found something they need sometime to read the entire thread to find the information. For the person who have the knowledge they are bored to tell each time the same thing...

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post #9 of 17 (permalink) Old 05-21-2019, 04:19 AM Thread Starter
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I don't think threads is a good idea for Discord. It's not meant to be a drop-in replacement for forums, just like there's not much benefit in converting forums into chats. It has lots of other things out of the box which make it attractive, think threads but presented in a different fashion with a different kind of interaction.
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post #10 of 17 (permalink) Old 05-21-2019, 05:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecosmeri View Post
i'm a forum user , and also administrator of facebook group MV Agusta France.

. . . for me the forum is no more the best ways to share information on internet, because it's difficult to share picture, to discuss... but it's actually the best way to keep knowledge. . .
With the greatest respect, there's nothing easier than drag and drop a picture into the clearly labelled 'Drag Files Here To Attach' box.

Whilst we all want to preserve and promote the MV Agusta brand it's probably fair to say that any platform that pursues that objective must be seen as a positive. However, I believe it unfair to claim that a 'forum is no more the best ways to share information on internet' when, again with the greatest respect, you haven't availed yourself to a lot of participation on this forum.

Another positive point about THIS forum is that there's no thoughts lurking in the back of our minds (or my mind at least) of the well-publicised personal information theft from Facebook members: https://www.theguardian.com/technolo...mation-hackers

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