The early 06' 910R more performance oriented then the 1078RR - MVAgusta.net
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post #1 of 12 (permalink) Old 04-10-2011, 10:45 PM Thread Starter
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The early 06' 910R more performance oriented then the 1078RR

As you might or might not know I have bend engaged in a motor swap between a 910R and a 1078RR. There have been some surprising revelations in the swap. First and most obvious, the 06 910R had the full pipe which we will be using with the new 1078RR motor. Its the full Arrow header offered in the aftermarket for the bike. The Following bikes in the 910 series had the cat back system which was the stock header without the cross tubes built in and a cat delete midpipe which was good but by no means comparable to the full system.

Secondly the ecu on the earlier fuel injection system had a race eprom. The new 1078 has no such modification because there is no option for decat pipe.

Now things get serious. There are some disturbing hard part issues that shouldn't be present in the larger engine. Parts that are obvious proof that MV was more enthusiastic with the 910R then with the 1078RR.

First off, and most disappointedly, I found both the 910R and the 1078RR had 46mm throttle bodies. They are the same units. There was no consideration for bigger cc here.

THEN, the valves are the same size. Once again, same stuff. 910R and 1078RR.. its the same stuff.

Here is the WORST! The 910R intake runners are hand ported. It MATTERS cause the 1078 intake runners don't match up at all. Its pretty bad. In the 910R motor the throttle bodies are blended into the head and the ports were cleaned up considerably. This is not present in the 1078RR motor. There are nasty gaps all through the runners and if you don't think so, pull your airbox and you will see.

YOU NEED TO ANYWAY because there is a ton of carbon build up on your intake valves. JUST LOOK.

So there it is... The MV boys were working a little harder on the 910R then the 1078rr. Its easier to punch a motor out to that size and make some extra power. Its a bummer but its true.

The good news is there is some major power to be gained in the head. We will be cleaning the 1078RR heads up once we get everything working. There is no excuse for the finish on these. I am truing to figure out what the effects of bigger (bored out) throttle bodies will be. If 46mm is great for the 910R I am guessing they aren't GREAT for a 1078RR but we will see.
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post #2 of 12 (permalink) Old 04-11-2011, 04:25 AM
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Interesting. I have a 2006 910R which I bought because it had 790 miles after 4 years and looked pretty immaculate. I really wondered if I should have bought a 1078RR but I didn't really like the paint and the 910R seemed like a bargain. Since I bought it I've grown to really like the bike and frankly it seems quick enough everywhere with the compromise set-up of decat and standard silencers and factory Eprom. There's no doubt the full system gave more top end eventually but the police would sooner or later have pulled me for noise.

A 1078RR is clearly a bit quicker than a 910R but I'm not sure that stock its as much quicker than it ought to be - and your findings would seem to confirm that a well fettled 910R will give a 1078 a decent run for its money.

As for the new bikes I'm not so keen as the alu trim seems to be plastic, the frame looks worse to my eyes (the top mountings look like an add-on and the 'old' frame seems plenty stiff enough to me. I can live with the on-off throttle of the 910R and I'm not sure I want a longer wheelbase either.

I'll be really interested to see the results of your clean up in the head because if you can get it to breath well and give it the fuel it can use then there must be some extra to unlock

My biggest wish is to sort the suspension which I think compares poorly on bumpy roads to an ohlins suspended Ducati I think so I'll do that I think before I tackle the engine. Thanks for info - If I change to 1078 I'll want to clear its head then!
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post #3 of 12 (permalink) Old 04-11-2011, 05:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clandestinejinx View Post

First off, and most disappointedly, I found both the 910R and the 1078RR had 46mm throttle bodies. They are the same units. There was no consideration for bigger cc here.

MV opted for grunt (torque) and not for high rpm output.
For low RPM toruqe you need high speed air flow for enough vortice, therefor 46 instead 48 mm

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post #4 of 12 (permalink) Old 04-11-2011, 05:40 AM
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I thought that the red valve cover on the 910R stood for having polished ports. So that led me to believe that the red valve cover on the 1078RR meant the same. I guess I was wrong thinking that.

B750 and B1078 RR both gone now.

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post #5 of 12 (permalink) Old 04-11-2011, 10:59 AM
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I've owned both a '07 910R and currently a '09 1078RR... I can tell you the 1078RR is a much stronger motor, especially in low end grunt!

I don't know of the "inards" details you speak of, but I know the 1078RR goes like stink! I am very happy with my decision to trade up.

As far at the ECU goes, I bought the full Ti MV Corse exhaust that came with a new ECU which eliminates the CAT/o2 sensor, so I know that option is there.
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post #6 of 12 (permalink) Old 04-11-2011, 11:53 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by cdamb View Post
I thought that the red valve cover on the 910R stood for having polished ports. So that led me to believe that the red valve cover on the 1078RR meant the same. I guess I was wrong thinking that.
The 1078RR I have hasn't been ported. Its easy to check, take off the airbox and look down the throttle bodies. Whats really scary is the carbon buildup on the valves.
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post #7 of 12 (permalink) Old 04-11-2011, 02:17 PM
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If you port and increase the throttle body size you will change the hp/torque curve.

You may gain a bit on the top but you will loose power and respose on the bottom.

Just make sure you know what to expect before you make the changes.

port matching rarely has a measurable result and it's labor intensive.
I'd bet MV decided it wasn't beneficial to do it on production street bikes but I would still take the time to do it my own bike during a rebuild.

I'm sure the throttle bodies were chosen for the 1078 to achieve a specific result.
And I don't think it reflects on how performance oriented MV was or is.
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post #8 of 12 (permalink) Old 04-11-2011, 02:33 PM
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I'd have thought you could increase the throttle body size but if you want to keep the bottom end as well as building more top end you'd need to have a bit longer inlet tracts - for which there may not be room? Unless you fit the variable length inlet tracts and ECU to control them?

In any case if you left the throttle bodies the same size and clean up the head I wouldn't have thought that would hurt and would probably give you a bit extra everywhere.
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post #9 of 12 (permalink) Old 04-11-2011, 03:23 PM Thread Starter
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That would be a cool mod, but where do you score a set of those? I bet a microtech could run um though. Didn't they come on the senna?
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post #10 of 12 (permalink) Old 04-11-2011, 03:41 PM
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The Tamburini and CC had them I think and of course the new 2010 F4 bikes have the mk2 version. I've no idea if you can get the parts or for what price -sorry

There are so many changes on the 2010 bikes I suppose those parts would be tricky to fit even if you can get them.
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